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Do true subs males exist anymore? This was asked in sub women for males but I would like to see the

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6 months ago • 01/13/2020 5:40 pm
ambicurious • 01/13/2020 5:40 pm
"Depends where you live and who you interact with, friend. Submissive doesn't mean weak or lacking confidence..."

Quite right. And I didn't mean to imply that I hold that view. I should have added more qualifiers, or just rewritten my comment to make myself more clear.

One of the ladies indicated that she doesn't see a lot of submissive men around, online, or otherwise, that they seem reticent to declare themselves more openly as submissives and are thus not so easy to find, or words to that effect.

And I am sure you are right that it depends where you live and who you interact with. Those of us who are open minded, and are somewhat familiar with power exchange relationships don't view submissive men as unmanly.

But most people live and work among people from the vanilla culture. And in the vanilla world there are plenty of people who know next to nothing about power exchange relationships and who think of sissy cuckolds or some such thing when they hear the term submissive male, and we know that doesn't describe all submissives. There are men who must maintain a certain image for their jobs, or else face demotion and discrimination. Companies can even make up reasons to fire you and you may not have any recourse. I am personally aware of how rumors can circulate and destroy one's chances at advancement, and even make it difficult to work effectively in one's current position. I had a one night stand with a transgender in 1989; she took me to a motel, one of those cheap ones with a hot tub in the room and mirrored walls and ceiling. I was a naive fellow back then. I have never been able to confirm it, but I believe I was photographed, perhaps videoed. You would think someone would have told me what was making my ears burn. But it seems no one wants to be the one to give you the news, they all want to leave it to someone else. Besides, I think most people thought I must already know and just didn't want to talk about it, and was just feigning ignorance.

What is the old saying? You can paint a fence and not be known as a fence painter, but suck one dick and you're a cocksucker forever. Every few years I could see the rumor pop up again here and there, at different jobs, in the faces and reactions of people I worked with, girlfriends who suddenly broke up with me with no explanation, etc. I hired a detective but he said "everyone likes you, you have nothing to worry about". I knew that wasn't true, but apparently he felt it was his job to make me feel better, not give me the truth. (A customer cryptically told me once "Better watch out, somebody might kill you." I asked why and she said "I ain't saying nothing." The detective told me the girl thought I was a great guy.)

If this had not happened to me, I would not believe it could be possible to have your life turned upside down like that, and for everyone to keep you in the dark. I knew that people were not being candid and honest with me, but I couldn't do anything about it. It became very depressing. I tried contacting people in the gay world to ask for help in finding out what had happened, but nobody I talked to was willing to get involved, or they acted as though they thought I had issues, wasn't being honest with them, and so on. That one night stand was dysphoric for me and wasn't something I wanted to repeat, even before the crap hit the fan. I was eventually diagnosed with chronic pain after an MRI showed a back injury and retired from work early. Perhaps I could have worked longer with narcotic pain meds, but the combination of pain and the mysterious issues I faced at work were too much. My company put me on disability.

I related that story only to make the point that I am sure there are submissive men who live and work in the vanilla world, and are aware of how submissives are perceived and talked about in that world, and don't want to risk anyone finding out about their kink. It doesn't matter what is true, only what people believe to be true, and how those perceptions may impact their lives. I am not saying it is right, or fair, just that realities must be faced squarely.

If you live and work among people who are enlightened and you would not be negatively impacted should your preference become known, then you should count yourself fortunate. But not everyone is that fortunate. I know attitudes have changed, especially in the last decade, but the newer attitudes are by no means universal, and men don't want to face unnecessary negative issues at work. And there may also be serious social issues, depending upon circumstances.

I think there would have to be total trust between the submissive and the female dominant for the relationship to work. I mentioned I was in contact with one lady who broke a rule we had agreed upon before I even met her. It was actually a rule she had suggested, or promised, i.e. that she would never ask me for money. How could I trust someone like that?

I am sure my life is a cautionary tale to people who know the details of which I am still in the dark. Nobody wants to risk being me.
And if submissive males are harder to find, that may be a reason.
Knightsundere​(sub male)
6 months ago • 01/13/2020 6:44 pm
Knightsundere​(sub male) • 01/13/2020 6:44 pm

.. damn. Sorry for being quick, that is an absolutely brutal experience to have lived through. Sometimes I forget that my perspective is from top to bottom made of the modern era (I was born in 00), so it's legitimately difficult to imagine that many people acting in such a way for what's nowadays a.. semi-normal event.
You're probably right though. People's opinions and views can change, but like anything else that grows, the layers underneath will always remain. Thanks for sharing man, opened my eyes a little.
6 months ago • 01/13/2020 7:53 pm
ambicurious • 01/13/2020 7:53 pm

Thanks. I too often post comments without proof reading them, not just for grammar but for ways to reword the comment to more accurately convey my intended message. The way I worded my first post left it a bit ambiguous as to my point of view. I thought you were a young fellow from your photo. And you express a refreshing point of view one seldom hears from people of my age group.

I think you and your peers need not worry about my experience, as older people recognize that attitudes and norms are different for the young generation so there is an acceptance of alternative lifestyles for young people. Companies also don't want to be sued and now have HR departments eager to protect employees from a hostile environment. There are safeguards in place now. In the early 90s the Internet was wide open; it was viewed as personal communication much like a letter instead of as a public forum. This was before social media. They really didn't have any body of law regulating it. So if my photos were posted somewhere online at that time, and I suspect they probably were, even if I had found out about it I don't know if there would have been anything I could have done about it from a legal standpoint. (Not everyone viewed me with contempt. I could tell there were people acting very concerned about me. They just wouldn't tell me anything. Those 'good intentions' hurt me worse than anything else though. Someone else was making decisions whether I should be told about something which destroyed my professional and personal life. I didn't get a say in the matter.)

I don't think the same thing could happen to someone of your age. Your peers would alert you if you were treated in a similar manner, but I think it just wouldn't happen in the first place. Things have changed.
Older guys like me will still be judged by our peers, to a large extent, by the standards and norms imprinted upon us from our youth. For many of us, there can still be negative repercussions, except in the predominantly liberal regions of the country.

Thanks again for you reply. Best regards
Rich527​(sub male){Not collar}
6 months ago • 01/14/2020 3:49 am

Sub males are out there

Rich527​(sub male){Not collar} • 01/14/2020 3:49 am
Sub males are out there , yes there are a lot of fakes out there there is no doubt about that , but there are fakes on both sides . In the world of cyberspace one should be cautious if they are to meet the one in which they are searching for . There a lot of people out there with no so good intentions and there are those that have good intentions. It’s tough to meet the one in which your kinks are all aligned . So is finding someone who lives close, is realistic , and is who they say they are ... I’m real but with this lifestyle like being single it’s all a crap shoot to meet someone who is who they say they are ..
bboislut​(sub male)
6 months ago • 01/14/2020 3:56 am
bboislut​(sub male) • 01/14/2020 3:56 am
So.. What is a real male sub and what is a fake one?
bboislut​(sub male)
6 months ago • 01/14/2020 4:05 am
bboislut​(sub male) • 01/14/2020 4:05 am
That seems like a total waste of everyone's time. Its really difficult to find like minded people. I get that everyone's protecting their privacy so i cant imagine the concept of misleading someone who has taken interest! in my own
asubmissivetoy​(sub male)
6 months ago • 01/14/2020 5:54 am
asubmissivetoy​(sub male) • 01/14/2020 5:54 am
I've followed this thread for a few days now, and while a lot of this was already covered in some fashion, I still wanted to leave my opinion on the matter, in the event that it is helpful to someone. There is going to be some generalizations here and there to provide context...

Outside of the kink community, being submissive is often equated with being weak. In some aspects outside the kink community, being "weak" is still ok. For instance, an attractive woman can often identify as submissive, even in the vanilla world, and there are plenty of people, kink related or not, that find that attractive. While this might also be the case in some places for submissive men, it's hardly ever portrayed in anything but a negative light.

Add on the fact that so much of the online kink-D/s community seems to be comprised more of two types of people.
1. Non kinky people thinking they can surf through the scene on occasion for a quick hookup or the occasional quick fun.
2. The types (men and wemon both) of people who identify as a dominant, but have no idea what being a dominant actually means and are just using the title to try and get something they see as exciting, or that might make them easy money.

As if those weren't enough of a barrier on their own, then you have to include the reality that the actual number of real dominants that are both local, and that aren't going to give you a hard time, or sneer at you because your a man that identifies as submissive, and that barrier is suddenly more like a mountain range, and your equiped with the most ineffectual gear possible for that journey.

If all of that wasn't enough to disuade you, and beat you down to the point of wondering if it's worth it to keep advertising and looking, then you might be lucky enough to actually think you've found someone that could work out, and you would finally be able to both get what that part of you needs, and be able to give someone else what they're looking for. But then you get ghosted 2 months into getting serious. Or the person suddenly decides that they are no longer dominant cause they weren't actually sure to start with.
Or you've been really really careful with this latest person, and your just talking online for now, and not getting too attached, and then a night finally roles around and you feel like it might be ok to start on some basic tasks and see how things go. So you get an hour or so into some play for the first time, and the person is suddenly asking for money to take things further, even though you stressed multiple times that you aren't interested in findom in the slightest.

And when you've picked yourself up from that, and finally come to the conclusion that you just have to keep at it, and eventually, through the process of elimination, and with much perseverance, that you'll eventually find someone, that's when you suddenly spend a random three weeks getting the most offensive, assuming, demanding and derogatory messages so far, back to back, for seemingly no reason.

It's enough to make you start wondering what you might be doing wrong. For the most part though, and this is still something I have to remind myself of, there's nothing "wrong" with you. The numbers just aren't in your favor. Don't stop posting, don't stop looking. Go to muches, place and update adds, bump thread posts and personals.

Cause there are real dominants out there, they just can't always find the submissives, for the same reasons...
Meg​(dom female){NotLooking}
6 months ago • 01/14/2020 8:27 am
Meg​(dom female){NotLooking} • 01/14/2020 8:27 am
ambicurious wrote:

Older guys like me will still be judged by our peers, to a large extent, by the standards and norms imprinted upon us from our youth.

I am so so so sorry that you had to go through this. I wish you were born in a different time, when people weren't so ignorant and judgemental.

Rich527 wrote:
One who leads the person on who they are talking too then does nothing that’s a fake .

or that person became uncomfortable with the situation and thought it best to leave before things went too far. You can't be sure why someone severs contact.
tallslenderguy​(sub male)
1 month ago • 06/01/2020 8:38 pm
tallslenderguy​(sub male) • 06/01/2020 8:38 pm
KarmaCollar wrote:
One can really only assume (like all human qualities) that there has to be a spectrum or slliding scale on which any given individual would travel depending on their natural baseline, events in their lives, and influencing interactions, etc.

A Dom/Domme is probably more inclined to define a sub using personal standards/preferences- wanting to ~make~ them fit their expectations rather than accept the more basic (and less interesting) fact that a sub is a unique individual and He/She may be the factor that doesn't actually fit in the situation.

The same can be said for many subs who are so ready to concede control/responsibility that they would rather accept an uncomfortable situation than conclude, "this is a Dom/Domme but not the right one for me" and probably find it even harder to be responsible for declaring/enforcing a reasonable departure.

You often have two people who don't mind an 'uncomfortable' fit trying to shove a square peg in a round hole. Often neither know when to give up the effort.

I also feel like there are probably many male subs who haven't had the experience or are even aware of their potential preferences

Was so happy to discover this thread this morning, so many thoughtful and insightful replies.

i too like the "spectrum" theory thinking of it as not only linear, but multidimensional (iow, "it's complicated). i discovered this thread inadvertently while reading through gay Dom male profiles turned up using the search engine here. It's not my first time doing that since i have been here, but i typically end up feeling rejected and disqualified reading those profiles and ads by things like "looking for a young,...." or the first few lines are demanding "complete" this or "total" that from someone they have never met or interacted with? Or they are the few word profiles or ads: "Strict but fair Dom looking for sub who knows their place (and will do my dishes too.)" i tried expanding the search to Bi Dom males, but gave up fairly early on because they kept talking about "she," or "her," and i again felt like they were't referring to me (even though they could call me that and i'd wear lace panties for them, i don't get the impression i'm what they are looking for by what they write lol, sigh).
So, your point:
"A Dom/Domme is probably more inclined to define a sub using personal standards/preferences- wanting to ~make~ them fit their expectations rather than accept the more basic (and less interesting) fact that a sub is a unique individual and He/She may be the factor that doesn't actually fit in the situation. "
That resonates and relates to my more frequent experience.
i don't think my indviduallity makes me less interesting, but understand that chemistry is part of "interesting." i'm encouraged by the number of Dom's here who do not think they are going to ~make~ their sub "fit," but understand that part of intitial communication is to determine "fit," (compatability).

i think you are spot on about a Dom being more inclined to "make" a fit, and sub inclined to "concede" a fit, and there seems to be few who try it on first to determine fit before 'purchase.' Communication, eh?

i'm a male with a submissive nature. i can trace my sub nature back to age 6-7, though i had no understanding of it at that age. In fact, i learned how to hide and cover that part of me pretty well by the time i was 12 or 13, for survival. Retrospectively, i can see it clearly in all sorts of places.

"I also feel like there are probably many male subs who haven't had the experience or are even aware of their potential preferences."


More generally, i think that relationship is a big part of the process of self discovery and self expression. Everyone is at a different place of self discovery, and not everyone knows how to express the parts of their self even if they are aware. One of my most profound experiences was with a Dom who saw something in me and knew how to bring it to the surface. He ended up owning a piece of me forever because of it lol, but it wasn't even on my radar until He showed me that part of myself. Which is a really poor way to explain what happened. The reality was, He saw something in me that He needed and wanted and i had a reciprocal response of need and want. Attraction, chemistry and bond. wow.

i think reality is, Dom or sub is a state of being, but also a continuous journey of self discovery, learning how to express and finding people to express that with?