rapidlyhip(switch male)
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4 years ago •
Dec 22, 2019
Re: Do true subs males exist anymore? This was asked in sub MsEbonyAngela wrote: I have seen responses on challenges in another thread and didn't see that it was geared to males until after I responded, but was intetesting. So here it is in reference to Dominant Women for sub/slaves. To start off I think the challenges exist on both sides
it definitely challenges both sides. I had a good start to a dynamic but it fizzled because my Domme's 'real life' got in the way. I am on the hunt again if you'd care to talk more and explore... |
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Online now
Byrdie(switch female){rl only}
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4 years ago •
Dec 22, 2019
Yes, there are. I've met them at kinky conferences, workshops, campouts, teas, munches and play parties. I'm more likely to meet them at events than I am through online means, because if they have enough fortitude to be submissive in front of other people, there's a higher likelihood that it will continue one-on-one.
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| slaveforfun |
4 years ago •
Jan 8, 2020
This is a confusing issue for men . I am totally dominant extremely demanding , could never hold a job because of it so ended up self employed and very successful, but, after work (in the bedroom) I like to let a woman take over sometimes . I ask the head mistress at Club Fem and she said I'm submissive because I like a woman in control for sex, but it creates a real power struggle the rest of the time . All the videos on How to Pick Up Girls say a man needs to be very dominant to get the girl , where does that leave me ?
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Knightsundere(sub male)
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4 years ago •
Jan 8, 2020
@slaveforfun
You'll have to pardon me since I can't speak from experience on this, but from what I have gathered, it's really important to make sure you're separating the relationship with another person from a relationship with a sexual partner, e.g. you're not viewing the approach to a person as a single sheet that covers all the issues. Take it slow, figure out what the person you're lusting after needs, decide whether that's something you can fulfill and go from there. For what it's worth though, I highly doubt a dominant woman is going to be impressed by a sub attempting to "out-dominate" her in order to gain footing. Seems like a bad idea and kinda breaks "good relationship" convention to begin with. Tough discussion to respond to though, feels like a conflict of interests LOL. Yyyyes? "True" subs would be defined by what their dom needs, though, so it's a pretty subjective question. I'm not going to be a compatible sub with every dom, as much as I'd like to be. |
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Meg(dom female){NotLooking}
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4 years ago •
Jan 10, 2020
@Knightsundere
Your entire post is extremely correct. There is no blanket solution to attract all females. To the OP: Define "true sub." Is it a guy in a gimp mask that I keep in the basement for lolz? Is it the dude I whip on Tuesdays and Thursdays? Is it a leather-clad and ball-hobbled stool in front of my TV? How about the hunk of flesh I use to practise thing pretty shibari knots? That man in the corner in the frilly pink dress? Subs are different things to different people regardless of gender. My sub fits my definition of a true sub for my purposes. He's been into physical restrained since before he hit puberty. He thinks my feet are magical talismans. He makes me wonderful meals. He lets me spend an hour thing him up like a pretty package. He lets me do other things with him. Yes, the community has a lot of frauds, but of course there are real subs. |
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peteriksolo
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4 years ago •
Jan 11, 2020
Depends on what you mean by "true sub".
Every single person is different. Everyone has some preferences. Just because most guys are more visual and into simply getting off, doesn't mean they don't like humiliation and submission. I guess most just want sex with Femdom practices, while they don't even think about being a full time submissive. Doesn't mean they wouldn't enjoy it - but nobody even shows them what it is. Guys are served Femdom porn to jack off and that is what we do. Nobody takes us into practical training or puts a cage on us and we hardly explore those things alone. I believe it actually has to be partially FORCED on a guy to become fully submissive. Like, you need to "break" that guy and teach him that only by complying to the things you want, he might get what he wants. So in other words, someone needs to teach the man to be real sub. |
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| ambicurious |
4 years ago •
Jan 11, 2020
Short answer: I don't know.
I wanted to explore this myself and tried reaching out to a couple of female dommes through fetlife. I spoke with a local lady about my interest in trying it out. We discussed things, and I bought some restraints she said I should get before meeting her. One thing we agreed to was that she wouldn't ask me for money. But before we ever met in person she did just that. That ruined the whole thing for me. And we never met. I think if I knew a lady as a friend first, so we knew each other and I could trust her to work within the limits we agreed on, I would be up for trying the submissive role. I suppose I am not what one would consider a true submissive though. I don't naturally like for a woman to tell me what to do, as I hear male submissives say about themselves. Given the cultural contempt by both men and women for men who are seen as weak, lacking confidence, and submissive, a submissive male would most likely want to keep his vanilla world from knowing about his submissive nature, as it could have a very negative impact on his career in many cases, and his social standing as well. It doesn't seem surprising to me therefore that submissive men are much harder to find than submissive women, dominant women, and dominant men. |
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Meg(dom female){NotLooking}
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4 years ago •
Jan 13, 2020
my sub can't post for some reason so here:
MegsDandelion wrote: I suppose as far as validity goes, as many have pointed out, it's a matter of semantics if you really want to know exactly what OP means by "true sub". For the sake of argument though, I'll assume that "not-true" means a sub that has a variety of "flaws", which I will adress. Not giving into your kinks: hardly needs bringing up. I think it's unfair to expect any sub to be into whatever their Dominant is into at any given moment. It's also unrealistic. It's why every D/s-couple makes for a unique dynamic. If you have an extensive number of kinks, it only follows it's unlikely you will find someone who has the same exact ones. Especially if it's also someone you want to connect with on an emotional level. Trust me. The latter is more important than the former. Any unwillingness of the sub to deal with kinks outside their comfort zone does not -in my opinion- make them any less of a sub. It just means they are submissive within the scope of the dynamic. Subbing only when it's pleasurable: I can see how one might mark a sub like this as invalid. A true sub is a sub all the time, aren't they? Personally, I would disagree. It again all boils down to the scope of the dynamic you have. I think it's perfectly reasonable and valid to tether a hierarchy to a certain time and place. This includes taking a break from one's role if they so desire. That doesn't mean that within the scope of that dynamic, the involved sub isn't a true one, I find. Not always obedient: whilst I think it might be fair to argue that a true sub would always want to please their Dominant in some way, it is also true that the human condition always has us weighing our interests. There may be a place or time in which the command given to us by our Dominant doesn't make sense, and we depend on our own wits to decide whether or not to disobey. Or maybe even slightly more liberal, in certain situations we disobey because something outweighs our desire to obey. And then accept our punishment. Even without being a brat, I think struggling with the balance between obeying and being disobeying is quintessentially part of a sub. Topping from the bottom: honestly the most valid aspect that comes to mind when thinking of what might dismiss a sub as true. I suspect most, if not all subs are guilty of this every now and again. Though, where exactly do we draw the line when it comes to this? Here, I think it's important to distinguish semantics. Some people I've spoken to seem to think that showing any will falls within this category. That means no arguing, no backtalking, no disobeying(see above), no safewording, no taking some time off, no expressing your desires, no nothing. What these people want is a programmable shell, not a submissive. A Dominant that wants a human submissive, wants someone who WANTS to serve them. Therefore, their needs and desires should be most important to them. Because of that, I submit to you that a sub who makes a suggestion (even in the middle of play, unless it has been negotiated that he doesn't), does not fall into this category. Also, what do y'all silly people think a gag is for? It doesn't mean they are any less subservient. Now, manipulating one's Dominant by pulling subconsious or emotional strings might actually be topping from the bottom. I think it is something a sub shouldn't do and should not want to do. A sub who actively wants to do this, I may actually accuse of not being a "true sub". But that is, because one can say that this type of sub does not really want to be one. I think most subs just occasionally do this without being aware of it though. Which is perfectly normal. It's agreed upon by many psychologists that humans are unable to interact with one another without trying to manipulate them in some (minor) way. I think that's fine and does not say anything about the submissive other than that they are human. Therefore, it's not up to being a "true sub" to avoid this behaviour, it's up to those involved in that dynamic to give it a place and deal with their interactions between them healthily. So to me, it all really boils down to actually wanting to be a sub. To feel a desire to serve or let another dominate you. Because what is more submissive than wanting to submit? Some people kneel because they are at risk when they don't, or because there is some prospect to gain by doing so. No Mistress, I have nothing to lose or gain by serving you. I just -want- to. |
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Knightsundere(sub male)
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4 years ago •
Jan 13, 2020
Meg's post from her sub above mine more or less covers all the possible bases in this discussion. Well-communicated exceptions aside, treating your sub/dom as another human being in a standard, healthy relationship is and should be the default way of approaching BDSM. The only fundamental difference between a relationship defined by BDSM and a "traditional" one is the fact that society has developed in a way that, until recent years, heavily shunned a sexually "exotic" lifestyle; confusion about whether your partner needs to be totally and completely limp in his/her life just because they're into bondage and being smacked in the face a little seems silly to me.
ambicurious wrote: Given the cultural contempt by both men and women for men who are seen as weak, lacking confidence, and submissive, a submissive male would most likely want to keep his vanilla world from knowing about his submissive nature, as it could have a very negative impact on his career in many cases, and his social standing as well. It doesn't seem surprising to me therefore that submissive men are much harder to find than submissive women, dominant women, and dominant men. Depends where you live and who you interact with, friend. Submissive doesn't mean weak or lacking confidence, though I imagine I would try to hide it if I was exceedingly cowardly. |
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| ambicurious |
4 years ago •
Jan 13, 2020
"Depends where you live and who you interact with, friend. Submissive doesn't mean weak or lacking confidence..."
Quite right. And I didn't mean to imply that I hold that view. I should have added more qualifiers, or just rewritten my comment to make myself more clear. One of the ladies indicated that she doesn't see a lot of submissive men around, online, or otherwise, that they seem reticent to declare themselves more openly as submissives and are thus not so easy to find, or words to that effect. And I am sure you are right that it depends where you live and who you interact with. Those of us who are open minded, and are somewhat familiar with power exchange relationships don't view submissive men as unmanly. But most people live and work among people from the vanilla culture. And in the vanilla world there are plenty of people who know next to nothing about power exchange relationships and who think of sissy cuckolds or some such thing when they hear the term submissive male, and we know that doesn't describe all submissives. There are men who must maintain a certain image for their jobs, or else face demotion and discrimination. Companies can even make up reasons to fire you and you may not have any recourse. I am personally aware of how rumors can circulate and destroy one's chances at advancement, and even make it difficult to work effectively in one's current position. I had a one night stand with a transgender in 1989; she took me to a motel, one of those cheap ones with a hot tub in the room and mirrored walls and ceiling. I was a naive fellow back then. I have never been able to confirm it, but I believe I was photographed, perhaps videoed. You would think someone would have told me what was making my ears burn. But it seems no one wants to be the one to give you the news, they all want to leave it to someone else. Besides, I think most people thought I must already know and just didn't want to talk about it, and was just feigning ignorance. What is the old saying? You can paint a fence and not be known as a fence painter, but suck one dick and you're a cocksucker forever. Every few years I could see the rumor pop up again here and there, at different jobs, in the faces and reactions of people I worked with, girlfriends who suddenly broke up with me with no explanation, etc. I hired a detective but he said "everyone likes you, you have nothing to worry about". I knew that wasn't true, but apparently he felt it was his job to make me feel better, not give me the truth. (A customer cryptically told me once "Better watch out, somebody might kill you." I asked why and she said "I ain't saying nothing." The detective told me the girl thought I was a great guy.) If this had not happened to me, I would not believe it could be possible to have your life turned upside down like that, and for everyone to keep you in the dark. I knew that people were not being candid and honest with me, but I couldn't do anything about it. It became very depressing. I tried contacting people in the gay world to ask for help in finding out what had happened, but nobody I talked to was willing to get involved, or they acted as though they thought I had issues, wasn't being honest with them, and so on. That one night stand was dysphoric for me and wasn't something I wanted to repeat, even before the crap hit the fan. I was eventually diagnosed with chronic pain after an MRI showed a back injury and retired from work early. Perhaps I could have worked longer with narcotic pain meds, but the combination of pain and the mysterious issues I faced at work were too much. My company put me on disability. I related that story only to make the point that I am sure there are submissive men who live and work in the vanilla world, and are aware of how submissives are perceived and talked about in that world, and don't want to risk anyone finding out about their kink. It doesn't matter what is true, only what people believe to be true, and how those perceptions may impact their lives. I am not saying it is right, or fair, just that realities must be faced squarely. If you live and work among people who are enlightened and you would not be negatively impacted should your preference become known, then you should count yourself fortunate. But not everyone is that fortunate. I know attitudes have changed, especially in the last decade, but the newer attitudes are by no means universal, and men don't want to face unnecessary negative issues at work. And there may also be serious social issues, depending upon circumstances. I think there would have to be total trust between the submissive and the female dominant for the relationship to work. I mentioned I was in contact with one lady who broke a rule we had agreed upon before I even met her. It was actually a rule she had suggested, or promised, i.e. that she would never ask me for money. How could I trust someone like that? I am sure my life is a cautionary tale to people who know the details of which I am still in the dark. Nobody wants to risk being me. And if submissive males are harder to find, that may be a reason. |
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