Grey Gods Explanation

Grey Gods Explanation

TalentedOptimist​(dom male){open} • Nov 24, 2020

Sub genres of hip hop have been a hot topic between myself and European women.
Over coffee, the song Grey Gods came up and I answered some questions on the following lyrics:

1. Flip a fucking cross, I don’t need a Messiah
Fuck a crown of thorns, I got a crown of barbed wire.
2. Burn a church down, light my blunt with the fire.
Fumes got my head spinning like a fucking tire.
3. Me and my whole clique of pariahs. Hitting C notes like a choir. Hitting C notes like Mariah.

here was my take on it

1. Most “messiahs” in mainstream christianity are white. This has caused divide In black communities that have been targeted for years by political and public justice endeavors.....which are usually based in traditional christian values. Flip over the symbol of faith you believed in and tell you to your face I don’t need a messiah or savior.

a crown of barbed wire means many things in american culture. in slave history, mothers would sometimes drown their sons before having to sell them. sometimes that kid would resuscitate later or in the pit and run away. dying + resurrection. The barbed crown is a current urban symbol for those who have or will endure hardships only to have their life sacrificed and/or persecuted. In this lyric, he is conceding the idea of being any positive figure, he prefers the grind and struggle where his family and friends are.

2. Black churches being burned and shot up have been a common trope in american history. Did you know that rebellious slaves would empty out and burn down their own churches if they knew an attack was coming?

This evacuated the area, preserved religious relics and books, and made it look like an area was abandoned or already raided. Fumes make your head spin.

3. In general, a pariah is an outcast. Either by design or circumstance. In comics, pariah is an immortal being cursed with traveling to worlds that are about to end.

in this context, it’s a group of young men who witness the ends of multiple lives and dreams while growing up.

......
Now in exchange I got to learn about German understanding of Roman and Nordic mythology and history.

What have been some of your breakthroughs or realizations with music of today? .

DrKrall • Nov 27, 2020

Hannah Montana not being a virgin.

(And I wouldn't advice you to let Germans teach you about Norse Mythology. They weren't really part of it and they have a history of misunderstanding it and mixing it with weird ideas about a Master race.)

CoffeeDom​(dom male) • Nov 27, 2020

Considering the second half of that verse, I'm not inclined to read too much into it aside from "hey, this rhymes". Admittedly Rudy has a real kink about biblical references, but I think you're putting WAAAAY to much meaning into a typical hip hop verse.

The second half..

Your bitch wanna give me her saliva
Addin' six more bitches to the dick, now that's the Hydra
Pride to the Odyssey, I fucked your mom's vagina
She was soft and wet like papaya
Suicide for hire, holes in my designer
Haters scope me like a fuckin' sniper
Me and $lick are rippin' blades, waitin' to retire

... and the hook; "This for all you, this for all you, this for all you playa hataz.."

Shakespeare it ain't.

TalentedOptimist​(dom male){open} • Nov 27, 2020

I think you don’t give enough credit to artists and look for ways to disregard and dismiss instead of connect and reflect.
I didn’t know there was a limit on how deep I can read into things. Please share that law and regulation.

As for the second verse,

1. did you read the Odyssey?
2. adding 6 more bitches to the dick that’s a hydra. as in an evil entity that near impossible to defeat.
3. There are a lot of player haters. Previously known as degenerates, despots, traitors
or anyone who has your demise in mind as a goal or positive outcome.
4. You started the post with “i’m not inclined.”
Tells me there was little to no hope you finding anything meaningful.

5. Player haters. Second time. not a remix. Caesar had plenty of player haters. As did Alexander the great, every East African leader whose campaigns against colonization were aided by malaria, and of course, every US President.

Shakespeare is dead. With a questionable reputation. Which even if it was intact, was boring, round about, and mostly about people trying to dodge their problems instead of facing them head on.
I’ll enjoy artists where ever I feel like and will find meaning that many have missed due to their own opinions, again, where ever I feel like. And then share it with people who ask.

Another thing, most of these conversations are started with questions about African Americans, war on drugs, police brutality, and inner city violence. when people from other cultures ask about hip hop, the artists, and their ties to america abroad. I’ll notice that aside from the connection to a deeper meaning past life/death/survival/enemies, it’s difficult to tell them about much else.

Now, with that previous approach out of the way. Could you read deeper and answer the end question:

What have been some of your breakthroughs or realizations with music of today?

CoffeeDom​(dom male) • Nov 27, 2020

There's no law or order that says you can't ascribe any meaning to a song you'd like. I'm sure I could turn Happy Birthday To You into a Q-Anon conspiracy rant through tenuous connections with enough effort. That does not make it so. I based my opinion of logic and an analysis of the lyrics in context and compared to other samples of the artist's work. I am not required to accept your interpretation. I offer you the same logical test as I offered in another discussion; extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. You're not citing any of the artist's other works, interviews or contemporary examples to back up your interpretation, which assigns a lot of meaning to a guy talking about getting high, getting money, and ranting about his hater's moms vagina.

Yes, I've read the Odyssey. It's not the first or only mention of the Hydra in Greek mythology, nor is the number of heads fixed. You might just be cherry picking facts to fit the narrative.

I started the post with "Considering the second half of the verse". I note that you offer no deep explanations for saliva, papaya, designer, sniper, or any of the other words chosen. I applied Occam's razor there; they were used because they rhymed. You've offered no evidence in the form of a cohesive theme or meaning to the rhyme scheme beyond what Occam suggests.

My breakthroughs or realizations with the music of today? I offered you one already, but I'll elaborate. In troubled times, people turn to conspiracy theories and ascribing meaning to meaningless events and words as a way of providing comfort and a sense of control in troubled times. Some people see molestation in cheese pizza. Others see international cabals and their symbols in everyday objects. Some people read way too much into lyrics and writing. Apophenia and pareidolia; don't get em twisted, as they say.

TalentedOptimist​(dom male){open} • Nov 27, 2020

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. The war on drugs, Trump's presidency, Hillary Clinton's very existence, the current state of international politics and socioeconomics, and the war on terror.... are proof of that. I will double up in saying that mainstream Christianity is a collection of extraordinary claims that require extraordinary proof. That was used as a basis to invade, defile, and dominate other cultures. My second part of relating to these lyrics come from that. The lyrics fit what I've been through, and the experiences of many like me. That's a fact, not an opinion.

To relate to, and notice the relation of, the reverse in a musical artist's lyrics is not a conspiracy. Humanity has been doing that for centuries. Every aspect of your analysis is defeated by the facts that you 1. stated you didn't want to read further than your surface impression, 2. then took my post OUT of personal context and into a conspiracy seeking theorist, as if I did not start with "here is my take on it." Much different from something more conspiracy theorist natured such as "This is what this song means." "All should react to this content as if it's fact." "We need to further examine this because if we don't, the end is nigh."

My post: Heard a song I liked and shared thoughts in a multi-faceted conversation that was personal in nature, personal affiliation with mentioned topics, and the applicable nature of these lyrics to have meaning in depicting the environment that I, and many like myself, have endured.

I heard something I liked. Affiliated it with personal life experiences. And came across people in multiple countries who felt the same way.
There is no illusion or misconception.

Your response:
1. Separated aspects of the original post
2. Combine said separated aspects to your own personal opinion and then attacked the logical nature of your own product. And in the same breath, asked for proof of my "claims" WHILE labeling me a conspiracy theorist.
3. The aforementioned combined your first response of: "I'm not inclined to read too much into it aside from "hey, this rhymes".
4. Versus: "I based my opinion of logic and an analysis of the lyrics in context and compared to other samples of the artist's work."
Quick question: The lyrics come from Ruby Da Cherry, on a Ramirez track, directed by DJ Paul from Three Six Mafia.) Which specific works did you compare?

Next up, Occam has been dead for 800 years. The world, as well as the people/cultures/logical theory in it, has changed.
Two main issues using Occam's razor as a tool to prove or disprove an explanation: One, determining whether or not something is simple (say, empirical evidence) is subjective -- meaning it's up to the individual to interpret its simplicity. Two, there's no evidence that supports the notion that simplicity equals truth. Occams razor was used as a logical tool by logicians who would mob mentality subjects, works, and theories to no end until they died. So please, give an example of what you want to be proved. Because of my liking of the song, the fact this conversation happened, and that there are contextual truths in the lyrics are non-debatable. Even then, Occams razor dictates whatever seems simplest is most likely the answer. My post is way more simple than your self defeating responses.

As a further example, (combining what I said earlier) you are not required to accept my interpretation. Regardless of me never saying "interpret" in the original post. But have had to use it when answering back to Occam's razor, conspiracy theories, dismissal of the lyrics, and more. You're right. things could change though, if I got a group of people to support my idea, invaded your home. Kidnapped your family, forced them to give up their religions, and base logical reasoning for how the world works.
This process could be done, for example, by using a religious figurehead of Caucasian origins; along with waging wars, crusades, and one of the largest propaganda operations in human history. Said operation being mostly filled with extraordinary claims of eternal salvation...given by mortals. Which years down the line, after failed interactions with church, state, and what the rest of the world views as law and order, I could very rightly claim that "I don't need a messiah."
The lyrics are rooted in deviation from religious norms and delving in vices and grudges at the behest of a corrupted world.


Don't get it twisted. Because if I'm reading too deep. Does that mean you met the artists, reviewed all of American history, and found evidence that artists of today (this artist in particular) are unable to read history and involve past events and logical theories into their lyrics for a new generation? That seems like more of a reach than anything I have said thus far.

TalentedOptimist​(dom male){open} • Nov 27, 2020

"Considering the second half of the verse". I note that you offer no deep explanations for saliva, papaya, designer, sniper, or any of the other words chosen. I applied Occam's razor there; they were used because they rhymed. You've offered no evidence in the form of a cohesive theme or meaning to the rhyme scheme beyond what Occam suggests."

Combining what I said above. Heres the full lyrics:

Flip my fuckin' cross, I don't need a Messiah
Fuck that crown of thorns, I got a crown of barbwire
Burn a fuckin' church, light a blunt with the fire
Fumes got my head spinnin' like a fucking tire
Me and my whole clique are pariahs
Hittin' C notes like the choir
Hittin' C notes like Mariah
____
Your bitch wanna give me her saliva

My take: Regardless of your affiliation, finances, status, or efforts to attain your partner. They still want me.

Addin' six more bitches to the dick, now that's the Hydra
Pride to the Odyssey, I fucked your mom's vagina

+My take: Already covered. but this comes from being a dog and messing with multiple women. Who of course, once you date too many, will come back to bite you in a way you can't fight back or maintain your personal status quo. Rappers have spoken on their problems with groupies, wives, rape allegations, and more across hip hop history. We already went back, that's just a quip at anyone who fits a character description of the Odyssey. Getting set up, losing loved ones, being isolated in a prison-like scenario while your wife is doing who knows what, etc etc

The vagina is used for sexual intercourse between a man and a woman. That is not an opinion, an extraordinary claim, or a product of apophenia and pareidolia.

She was soft and wet like papaya

++My take: once he got that ass, he compares it to Papaya. Which is a wet, soft and moist fruit.

Suicide for hire, holes in my designer

+My take: Suicide boys would take suicide like missions in the hood. The backlash from which would leave holes in their designer clothes. Clothes that, in their neighborhoods, were near impossible to afford and have now become a pseudo symbol of having risen against poverty and stacked odds.
There are a lot of fakes in this aspect though.

Haters scope me like a fuckin' sniper

++My take: Haters in all forms will hunch down to focus on hating on yours. A sharp level of hater focus is referred to as scoping. Common victims to this mindset are moderate accomplishments, any kind of success, and/or people's positive "interpretations" of music.

Me and $lick are rippin' blades, waitin' to retire

+My take: There are a lot of metaphors for ripping blades. Some have to do with hitting licks or doing some illegal activity to get enough money...to retire. Preferably with people who stood by you since day one. Example: Slick.

Miki​(masochist female) • Dec 3, 2020

Can't get into this, so my response is:

Skip the gray gods, gimme some Grey Goose.

Tthomas • Dec 3, 2020

What have been some of your breakthroughs or realizations with music of today? .......


That a lot of it is trash.

Miki​(masochist female) • Dec 3, 2020

Not that I am partial to "today's music" but through it all, it's the "ear of the listener" and each generation seems to call the music , among other things, of the following generation "trash" "noise" and so-forth.

In my grandparents' day, the adult generation found Elvis Presley to be vulgar, rock N roll in general, an abomination.

The generation who was into these artists and that material then cringed and covered their ears when the 1970s brought with them "Disco".

On and on it goes.

At the end of the day, while I don't like a lot of what's playing on the radio and online now, doesn't mean there is anything "wrong" with it, rather it's simply doesn't toast my bread.

One person's symphony is another's cacophony