Abuse veiled as protocol

Oneironaut L​(dom male) • Aug 28, 2022

A spanking for "misbehavior" would be called abuse in most vanilla settings. For kinksters it's pretty tame. It's all about context and perception, as long as everyone involved is a consenting adult and the various aspects have been negotiated beforehand people should be free to do what they do. What people are ok with can change as well, which is why maintaining communication is so important.

Some abusers do use bdsm as a smokescreen of sorts, but those won't be communicating to see what could be improved and they won't be working with their sub to determine how the dynamic works because they are only out for themselves. Which could be the metric I suppose, it becomes abuse when the subs feelings and wellbeing aren't being taken into account.

Hypothetical mind bender because I'm snarky today. Lets say there was a horribly abusive person, just a foul individual. They stumble upon bdsm as a way to let this out on someone else, but being clever they know people will see through them at some point. So they do their homework, learn all the best ways to dom, the best ways to look after a sub, all the perfect little ways to make a dynamic work for everyone. They meet someone! They hit it off! Because they are determined to not be found out as an abuser, they are THE perfect dom. Their submissive is the most fulfilled person you've ever met (honestly it's kind of annoying). Everyone holds their dynamic up as an example to strive for. Now if you ask them and they answer honestly they will tell you all of this is just an excuse to be a shitty person, but the fact remains that they do everything right. At that point are they an abuser or a dom?

"If you can't tell the difference, and I can't tell the difference, does it really matter?"

Zelia • Aug 28, 2022

If the sub consents, she isn’t being abused. Even if she is unhappy.

MasterBear​(other butch) • Aug 29, 2022

By definition a person cannot consent to abuse.

That being said legally a person cant consent to BDSM either.

I do not believe that consent nullifys abuse.

I believe that abuse is alive and well within BDSM relationships.

I also believe that abusive people become D or M types to unleash that abuse unchecked.

Zelia • Aug 29, 2022

The kind of protocols You refer to are not abusive if they are consented to by someone who can withdraw their consent or leave the relationship.

One may be manipulated and coerced into giving consent but I think that subs/slaves need to take some personal responsibility when it comes to educating themselves, vetting partners and being well versed in red flags.

Abuse within lifestyle relationships is an oxymoron. A lifestyle relationship should leave no room for abuse by its very foundation. Abuse exists of course, but it is simply abuse.

Bunnie • Aug 29, 2022

“How do you determine what is protocol and what is abuse veiled as protocol?”

@MasterBear,
This is an awesome question, thank you.

Like many things, I believe we each have our own “line in the sand” of where something turns from being a positive into a negative.
The major defining factor for me is of course, consent. However, another major defining factor, which helps to differentiate, when one is already co-existing in an agreed-to relationship dynamic, is, harm.
Even if consent exists, sometimes the situation simply becomes harmful to one/everyone involved. Be it physically, emotionally, mentally or spiritually. Again, it is up to the individual to determine that line in the sand for themselves, and what that looks like… however, for me, that is when it’s time to definitely re-evaluate. Although, does that specific moment of recognition make it abuse? I think not. This is where I circle back to consent here, again. If, when a re-evaluation has occurred and harm still continues, that’s when I would consider that it has stepped into a realm of abuse.

Sculpther​(dom male) • Aug 30, 2022

Sorry, I disagree with protocol being veiled as abuse. If the list of things in this post are experienced by anyone it is abuse, pure and simple.

Two reasons I say this, the first being consent needs to be "informed consent." The individual consenting needs to understand what they are consenting to and all the ramifications and nuances pertaining to that. The second, and perhaps the most important factor is, does the individual consenting to the requirements and/or regulations they are expected to adhere have the mental acuity and critical thinking ability necessary to make an informed decision regarding these activities?

I have encountered many who were subjected to this type of abuse by cult leaders, abusive spouses, captors, and a myriad of other offenders. In the deprogramming process the number of them who revealed being led down that particular garden path were not aware that there was anything wrong until it was almost too late was very alarming.

Abuse/deception only works if it is gradually introduced, similar to the story of boiling a frog. Put a frog in tepid water it will sit there happily as you turn up the heat until it is boiled, try to put it into water that is preheated too hot it will jump to it's freedom.

Mind abuse is one of the most subtle and yet deadliest of all kinds of abuse. Hypnosis gets a lot of discussion in bdsm, and, while it is true that it is next to impossible to get a subject to do something that goes against their core values, it is something that can be accomplished over time with a subject who, through manipulative mind abuse, can experience a subtle shift in core values until, what was once wrong, is no longer even a concern.

Knowledge is power, forewarned is forearmed, etc. etc. etc.

At the end of the day, like in all things, buyer beware. If it seems too good to be true, it probably is not. If it seems wrong to you at first glance, it probably is, and the words "trust me," should be a red flag the size of New Hampshire.

Miki​(masochist female) • Aug 30, 2022

I skipped the replies because I don't have a lot of time to spend in this fucked-up place, but from your post I gathered one thing:

Protocols. Without mutual consent and agreement beforehand those are a bus load of crap.

When I got to "financial" protocols and the sense that you have to sign over a pay check...

Unless giving away your hard-earned check turns you on, give the Dom the first $5 bill you EARNED and tell him to go wipe his ass with it.

No disrespect intended towards Honest Abe

Bunnie • Aug 30, 2022

You share a great point, @Sculpther.

TheProdigy​(dom male) • Aug 30, 2022

Abuse is in the eye of the beholder. the only deciding factor is *context* i dated a girl who wanted absolutly nothing to do with bills and so i handled all finances but to others, outside of relationship i was controlling.

Zelia • Aug 30, 2022

@Sculpther
Do You consider TPE dynamics to be abusive? What about blood play, sending daily naked and vulnerable images in a LDR, being tasked to use scarification to etch someone’s name into your skin or being shared with others sexually?
Just because protocols are in place doesn’t automatically mean they’re used in an overtly restrictive way, though that may be the preference of some.
Much of what we do in the name of pleasure could be perceived as abuse, yet is is not by those who willingly participate. Just because something ‘can be’ abusive doesn’t mean that it ‘is’.