nuli(sub female){Unkolared}
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4 years ago •
Nov 14, 2020
[quote="Master Havok"]
Bunnie wrote: The way I like to explain the difference is that a submissive will strive to become the best version of themselves for their Dominant, whereas a slave will become whatever their Master wants..
That's easy enough to answer. Anyone sub or Dom that thinks it. I have run into that judgemental thinking before during and after. I have been told the dumbest things by people who fail to understand a slaves mindset. I have been told he can kill me if he so desires (any person can kill someone even a sub) why do you wish to be a doormat? What are you to stupid to make your own decisions? Most won't like how I "think" the difference are between a sub and slave. A sub has the control a slave does not. Yes I am slave I have been told a natural slave (whatever that is) that doesn't mean my Master won't listen to me if he asks my opinion or thoughts on something. It just mean he doesn't have to take into account I guess is the word is to use. As for the quote you found. I think that works perfectly. Nuli |
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Online now
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nuli(sub female){Unkolared}
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4 years ago •
Nov 14, 2020
That's easy enough to answer. Anyone sub or Dom that thinks it. I have run into that judgemental thinking before during and after. I have been told the dumbest things by people who fail to understand a slaves mindset. I have been told he can kill me if he so desires (any person can kill someone even a sub) why do you wish to be a doormat? What are you to stupid to make your own decisions?
Most won't like how I "think" the difference are between a sub and slave. A sub has the control a slave does not. Yes I am slave I have been told a natural slave (whatever that is) that doesn't mean my Master won't listen to me if he asks my opinion or thoughts on something. It just mean he doesn't have to take into account I guess is the word is to use. As for the quote you found. I think that works perfectly. Nuli |
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Master Havok(dom male)
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4 years ago •
Nov 14, 2020
SoMuchTrouble wrote: There’s no one definition for these terms, so it’s always individually defined. Generally speaking people use slave to mean some level of deeper commitment, but there’s no hard and fast rule.
One educator I met identified as a slave but specifically not a sub, because ultimately she didn’t feel submissive in her behavior. She liked being owned and having to do what she was told, but she just didn’t like being subby and deferential all the time. In her ideal relationship she wants a master who absolutely expects her obedience, but she doesn’t want to constantly be subby in her behavior, just a slave in her life and role. I thought that was a fascinating distinction, and really helped illustrate to me the versatility of ways people interact with this lifestyle. That is interesting and from my point of view perfectly acceptable. I have also found that how a slave serves can change over time due to health/age or circumstances beyond a Owner's control. I have had to make adjustments on how my girl serves over the years. It doesn't make her any less of a slave in my eyes. She still is every bit as dedicated as she was when she came to my house many years ago. She can no longer kneel or even sit on the floor for any length of time but she will always have a place at my feet. Thank you for your reply. |
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AlexLeeSadist(dom male)
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4 years ago •
Nov 14, 2020
I like the way kara put it, and there are other fine thoughts here. The most succinct way I've heard it echoes what kara said:
"A submissive chooses to submit every time. A slave chooses once." |
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Master Havok(dom male)
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4 years ago •
Nov 14, 2020
OraclePollon wrote: I have been with a Dom and a Master and I do enjoy being a sub more. It is different to everyone, but I think Kara is very close.
To me, it is having a voice every day. It is knowing that my Dom will lead us, but it is because he has taken my voice and opinion into consideration in his decision process. He doesn't try to get me to do things for my own benefit, he teaches me. Not makes me sit and do mantras every morning that praise him as my protector. If he needs me to be a better person, he takes my hand and walks that path with me. A slave does not want that voice, so to speak, she does not want her opinion to put a shadow in her Masters mind about leading them to their garden. I am not saying some of these traits don't translate to the other, I do think I have some prominent slave tendencies. I just can't have a Master. Lastly. I detest people who think that a slave is more devoted to her Master than a submissive even to her Dom. There are different styles of devotion. Some come from absolute servitude, some come from being able to be your true self in your dynamic so you can provide you most vibrant colors to your Dom. I often discuss options with my slave before making a decision. She is an intelligent woman and a waste of a valuable resource not to gather her input. That being said, I explained to her early on the decision is mine alone and there will be times when I won't ask and she will not know what is going through my mind. She has learned over the years not to ask and just figure out how to make the best of the situation or ask how she may help make a positive outcome. |
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TheWhorelock(dom male)
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4 years ago •
Nov 14, 2020
Oh yeah, I mean she’s been in the lifestyle for like over 20 years if I recall, and both been a live in slave and owned multiple subs/slaves herself. I don’t think anyone could argue she is illegitimate. This is why I think it’s key to not get married to any one definition, because the reality is there is no one correct way.
There are a few incorrect ways, but mostly that’s just poor understanding leading to mislabeling. |
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Bunnie
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4 years ago •
Nov 15, 2020
What I often wonder is, why this incessant need to keep redefining what a word means just to “make it fit?” How much do we tear apart the word slave to make it all inclusive? And why? I don’t understand this mindset. If one is not a slave, then they are simply not a slave. The word doesn’t need to be redefined... the person simply needs to move on and find what word does best describe them. It’s not about less or more than... it’s about what that specific word and title carries with it... because to some it’s not a label... it’s a title.
A slave is different to a submissive and there’s nothing wrong with that. If a pair of jeans don’t fit, we either adjust our body or we simply look for ones that do... we don’t tear apart the jeans to make them adapt to us... that’s simply ridiculous. I don’t believe that “it’s solely about interpretation.” And I’m sure there are many communities out there who would agree... MAsT being one of them. I absolutely agree that poor labelling leading to misunderstanding is the most common confusion we see around the difference between what a submissive and a slave is... also a lack of being immersed in communities where knowledge and wisdom are passed on by those with knowledge and wisdom... meaning, those who actually live it. I understand and respect the fact that the on-line interpretation and “version” of what a slave is, is very different to what an in-person slave is, and sure, an on-line slave is not much different to an on-line submissive... much like someone who identifies on-line as a “kitten” isn’t necessarily a pet. But let’s not forget that these words have meaning. Just because you may not know what that meaning is, doesn’t mean that’s an invitation to create your own. There is a very big difference between trying to explain and share our individual interpretation of the meaning of a word, and simply making up our own meaning to make it suit us because we think it sounds like a cool label to put next to our name. |
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Master Havok(dom male)
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4 years ago •
Nov 15, 2020
"I understand and respect the fact that the on-line interpretation and “version” of what a slave is, is very different to what an in-person slave is, and sure, an on-line slave is not much different to an on-line submissive... much like someone who identifies on-line as a “kitten” isn’t necessarily a pet. But let’s not forget that these words have meaning. Just because you may not know what that meaning is, doesn’t mean that’s an invitation to create your own. There is a very big difference between trying to explain and share our individual interpretation of the meaning of a word, and simply making up our own meaning to make it suit us because we think it sounds like a cool label to put next to our name."
Yes, online and RL slavery can be very different, sometimes it is simply the interpretation of either the owner or slave, sometimes its grounded in the realities of life in general. For someone who has found an owner I would think it would be at the owner's discretion, but some consistency should be apparent. It may not be the same as what I believe but then I don't consider myself to be the base line for what a Master should be. I follow a strict Gorean code, or at least as much as anyone can in this world. As I explained to both my son and daughter as they grew into adulthood, they should follow their own path. I have a hard time meeting my own standards at times, I can hardly expect anyone else to do the same. I expect my girl to meet the standards I set for her, though she has hinted that I am very picky, I never set a standard out of reach. Though on occasion she might have to stretch to get there. I used to get irritated by many who would claim the Gorean culture online, yet would water it down so far to be unrecognizable as such. Many of them seemed to never have read a book from the series, let alone understand it. Mostly they just seem to want to live the fantasy without the work to go with it. Which boils down to experience and dedication. |
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