dollMaker(dom male)
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3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
I see you now, I see and recognise fully.
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Online now
simplylaura(sub female){djinni}
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3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
► Solace wrote: Recal that this is an opportunity for conversation. Conversation whose purpose is the exchange of ideas.
Whether I agree with Jashine or not, I found them calm, logical and open for discourse. Regrettably the same is not returned. There is no value in this tact. No changing of ideals or behavior will occur. If ones goals are not to eloquate why another is incorrect in a fashion that convinces them or other individuals...there is no reason for utterance. Calls for silence are no better, leaving violence as the final resolution. Violence which does not decide who is right, merely who is left. Elevate your standards and rise to the challenge of respectful and convincing rhetoric. Cogent discussion requires this. Otherwise please remain on the sidelines and refrain from misrepresenting your ideals with diatribes rather than convincing others to share your thoughts. Simply put, no. I'm sick of "cogent discourse" when it comes to other people's identities. I don't need to provide sources to defend someone's cis identity, so why is it necessary to do it for trans people? I have *plenty* of sources and have the credentials to defend my position easily, but in this realm? Fuck. No. Kink is an avenue for free sexual expression. Queer and trans people have foundational roles in the kink and leather scenes. This is no place to have "rational and logical" discussions about the validity of their identities, or to spew propaganda that is used to actively harm people. I'm not going to be nice about this and am sick of people on this site defending transphobes in the name of civility. |
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dollMaker(dom male)
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3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
► simplylaura wrote: ► Solace wrote: Recal that this is an opportunity for conversation. Conversation whose purpose is the exchange of ideas.
Whether I agree with Jashine or not, I found them calm, logical and open for discourse. Regrettably the same is not returned. There is no value in this tact. No changing of ideals or behavior will occur. If ones goals are not to eloquate why another is incorrect in a fashion that convinces them or other individuals...there is no reason for utterance. Calls for silence are no better, leaving violence as the final resolution. Violence which does not decide who is right, merely who is left. Elevate your standards and rise to the challenge of respectful and convincing rhetoric. Cogent discussion requires this. Otherwise please remain on the sidelines and refrain from misrepresenting your ideals with diatribes rather than convincing others to share your thoughts. Simply put, no. I'm sick of "cogent discourse" when it comes to other people's identities. I don't need to provide sources to defend someone's cis identity, so why is it necessary to do it for trans people? I have *plenty* of sources and have the credentials to defend my position easily, but in this realm? Fuck. No. Kink is an avenue for free sexual expression. Queer and trans people have foundational roles in the kink and leather scenes. This is no place to have "rational and logical" discussions about the validity of their identities, or to spew propaganda that is used to actively harm people. I'm not going to be nice about this and am sick of people on this site defending transphobes in the name of civility. My feelings too. @ Cage admin, close this trans hate filled thread please. Villanelle, CageMonkey please. |
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Jashine
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3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
Helen Joyce was right when she said that so-called trans activists will seek to silence anyone critical of gender self-ID, hence betraying their ideological focus. Here I’ve been called dangerous, toxic, a spreader of lies, actively harmful, a transphobe, a propagandist, and responsible for the deaths of queer and trans kids and adults. Quite a list! I think, simplylaura, that you have hoisted yourself by your own petard.
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LadySusweca(dom trans woman)
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3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
To be honest, I don't really care what these so called "experts" like Helen Joyce have to say. They don't know the experience and only have their opinions. Some "experts" are helpful and others are harmful. I guess that comes with such things as freedom of speech and freedom of the press. It's easy to be an "expert" though when you haven't had to live the experiences and can claim credentials even if they don't pertain to the topic.
I have never met anyone in the trans community who have talked to these so called "experts" about their experiences. All this does is hurt people who are just trying to live their lives. They want to just be who they are without all the crap of ideologies proposed by "experts" who are not even part of the trans community themselves. I am very lucky to have an employer who hired me for my education and experience instead of being concerned about me being a transgender woman. I'm grateful she treats me like a person and gives me respect because I don't see it from most of the world. I hope this thread does get closed. It showed me that even as a member of the trans community my voice didn't really matter. When it comes down to it this affects my life and probably not the people writing the "expert" opinions about the trans community except to make them money. |
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simplylaura(sub female){djinni}
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3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
► Jashine wrote: Helen Joyce was right when she said that so-called trans activists will seek to silence anyone critical of gender self-ID, hence betraying their ideological focus. Here I’ve been called dangerous, toxic, a spreader of lies, actively harmful, a transphobe, a propagandist, and responsible for the deaths of queer and trans kids and adults. Quite a list! I think, simplylaura, that you have hoisted yourself by your own petard. Let's add martyr to that list as well. |
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simplylaura(sub female){djinni}
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3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
► LadySusweca wrote: To be honest, I don't really care what these so called "experts" like Helen Joyce have to say. They don't know the experience and only have their opinions. Some "experts" are helpful and others are harmful. I guess that comes with such things as freedom of speech and freedom of the press. It's easy to be an "expert" though when you haven't had to live the experiences and can claim credentials even if they don't pertain to the topic.
I have never met anyone in the trans community who have talked to these so called "experts" about their experiences. All this does is hurt people who are just trying to live their lives. They want to just be who they are without all the crap of ideologies proposed by "experts" who are not even part of the trans community themselves. I am very lucky to have an employer who hired me for my education and experience instead of being concerned about me being a transgender woman. I'm grateful she treats me like a person and gives me respect because I don't see it from most of the world. I hope this thread does get closed. It showed me that even as a member of the trans community my voice didn't really matter. When it comes down to it this affects my life and probably not the people writing the "expert" opinions about the trans community except to make them money. 100% this. I'm on a nationwide research team for LGBTQ+ academics and *all* of our trans research is led by *gasp* trans academics! Imagine that! I'll never be first author on a paper about trans issues and I am 100% okay with this. A colleague of mine is currently engaged in a couple projects about trans joy (as opposed to trauma) and his research has been fascinating and wonderful. I can't wait for it to be released because people need exposure to this side of things. I'm sorry that your experience in the general public is being mirrored on here, a supposed safe site for all sexual expressions. I don't come around much since I met the love of my life on here, but this is one topic I won't ever let get by me. Take good care of yourself today!! |
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Malevolence(kinky female)
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3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
How about the real ‘experts’ are the ones who live in a patriarchal and heterosexual led society and have to deal with the hate aimed at them for being trans every day of their lives? Science says a lot of things, and don’t get me wrong, I believe in science, but life does not take place in the controlled environment of a lab.
Love and hugs @LadySusweca and @simplylaura. |
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I'mME
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3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
► dollMaker wrote: ► simplylaura wrote: ► Solace wrote: Recal that this is an opportunity for conversation. Conversation whose purpose is the exchange of ideas.
Whether I agree with Jashine or not, I found them calm, logical and open for discourse. Regrettably the same is not returned. There is no value in this tact. No changing of ideals or behavior will occur. If ones goals are not to eloquate why another is incorrect in a fashion that convinces them or other individuals...there is no reason for utterance. Calls for silence are no better, leaving violence as the final resolution. Violence which does not decide who is right, merely who is left. Elevate your standards and rise to the challenge of respectful and convincing rhetoric. Cogent discussion requires this. Otherwise please remain on the sidelines and refrain from misrepresenting your ideals with diatribes rather than convincing others to share your thoughts. Simply put, no. I'm sick of "cogent discourse" when it comes to other people's identities. I don't need to provide sources to defend someone's cis identity, so why is it necessary to do it for trans people? I have *plenty* of sources and have the credentials to defend my position easily, but in this realm? Fuck. No. Kink is an avenue for free sexual expression. Queer and trans people have foundational roles in the kink and leather scenes. This is no place to have "rational and logical" discussions about the validity of their identities, or to spew propaganda that is used to actively harm people. I'm not going to be nice about this and am sick of people on this site defending transphobes in the name of civility. My feelings too. @ Cage admin, close this trans hate filled thread please. Villanelle, CageMonkey please. Hold up........ Every post on here has not been filled with trans hate, bc I asked someone a question and there was no hate , dislike, anything except trying to get an understanding of the issues, I'm particular the one I brought up. So when I read your demand, it makes see a little red. And the reasoning behind your demand is ANOTHER ISSUE . In forum discussions because of their very nature, multiple people commenting, it's going to be filled with varying views and beliefs especially on gender, trans, whether young kids have the decision making ability to start the process [I'm sorry my mind went blank on the proper word, transitioning?] However not everyone who commented here seems to be transphobic. Maybe a better use of this message would be to ask you if you would answer this for me. Can you please describe or list some transphobic behavior? I think I would recognize subtle hate but now I s, thinking what I consider may be different from what you think is transphobic. |
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| DeepEmbrace(dom female) |
3 years ago •
Aug 28, 2022
This transphobic thread has been allowed to go on on this site for NINE FUCKING MONTHS. NINE FUCKING MONTHS!!! The Cage admin have no doubt seen it, read it, and they dont give a fuck about the overt transphobia and transphobic vitriol, hatred, and outright lies being spread on this thread. When are they going to do something??? When do they ever do ANYTHING when there is rampant racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia, and other attacks on marginalized groups on this fucking website? THEIR true colors are showing now as they always have. They allow this trash to fill this website because that is what they themselves agree with.
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