The Council

This does not presebtly exist.

With the present technology available ive done my best to search everywhere allowed by the multiple sites and apps at my disposal as well as many many Google searches. Nothing.
I've received many messages ppl asking where they are, do they exist, where can they be found, what can be done. Nothing.
Essentially the leaders of the communities we have that i have been able to find and have messaged personally have all told me the same thing. Not interested.

So we're left with the admins and moderators to watch their sites and apps, individuals to monitor the groups they create, organizers to have DMs that are hopefully qualified, all while everyone does anything they want without regulations or limits or having their actions questioned.
I've known quite a few ppl that were outted by the places they went and all they did was go somewhere else under a different name, deleted their account just to make a new one with a new email address. Same ppl, same problem.
Anyone can read the posts and forums of the constant problems that have been in the community way before Craigslist closed their personals.

So we need a Council. Specificly a group of our leaders that will do what needs to be done to regulate the indecency of this lifestyle.
I know theres a concil for riggers. To be known as a qualified rigger you need to proove your ability to them.
I know theres a council of NJ munches, they collaborate and schedule that states events to ensure they're done on different days of the week.
So thats it? No more? As limited as I am to my geographical location and the few fetiahes I actually enjoy theres nothing else? Of the whole east coast within the last 20 yrs ive knly heard of 2, no others? Guess they dont want to be widly known, could be private organizations, or they're simply not there.

What does it take to have a council? Ppl that want to do the work, that have the time to put in the effort, that are experienced enoughbof this lifestyle to specify whats acceptable as compared to everything else thats been going on.
How do you make it happen? Well as far as ive seen no one really cares about the community as a whole, they just want to do their own thing and thats good enough. No, theres more that can be done. Get to the top of the leader board, see who the ppl that teach were taught by, know who they'd follow. Cause essentially they're not gonna do it.
Can the populace force this to happen? Technically no, but everyone has their limits. So whats the best way of amkingnppl give in? Constant bothering? Stop going to their events while telling them why? Constant admiration? Nit-picking them with every concern this community has been dealing with? There's really jo right way to get anyone do what they dont want to and coercion usually leads them in the direction of indiference.
What would the Council do exactly? Hear ye, hear ye. Deciding what needs to be done about everything that has been seen as wrong by practicly everyone for so long I no easy task.
Its like letters to Santa. Each instance needs to be considered. All sides and perspectives need to be heard. Proof has to be found cause hearsay is just word-of-mouth gossip. Sometimes legal action has to happen to file for an organization's paperwork if they dont want to concede. Sometimes said repeat offenders need to be caught in the act. Sometimes theres nothing that cna be done about it cause no proof can be found. Sometimes the perpetrator cant be found cause the left the lifestyle completely or could even be incarcerated for other reasons. It takes a lot of time, a lot of effort, and most likely money no one wants to pay.

Before I was partnof this lifestyle I knew a guy from a local coffee house. He said he was gay, but was never seen with 1 guy, always in a group or with a couple. He was never directly included, but was always there with comments. He was never seen as partnered, but always seemed to squeeze his way into scenes. Ya talk to enough ppl and I heard he'd only be freindly with guys, but very touchy feels with girls. That happened with groups, with couples, in public, and in private. It was a collective understanding that he used the term of gay to get closer to women through their male partners.
I knew a female sub from Alabama that needed to be away from someone that told her she was his. She then had been online for some time to find a local partner and things seemed great till the met. At a hotel no less. From what she said things went well and they did what they talked about till it didnt seem enough for him. She got raped, he left money on the table for her 'services', called her a whore.
I knew a guy that used to help out at evebts, had heard hed done quite a lot, been around a few blocks. Assisted at the wrong event as something happened that made them talk and gossip about a bunch of stuff that had apparently happened before, but they only started to talk about it now. ostracized from that group, then another, and another. Then trying statt with any other was simply impossible cause no one wanted the bad publicity. The old groups talk and gossip for years after the organizer stopped organizing.
I knew a female sub that was in a dynamic and some said the wrong thing at the right time. Word spread, ppl repeated it, gossip, hearsay. She was ostracized from that group where it happened, then another, and another.
I knew a couple that frequently attended a local event. They decided to photograph their scene. No one else was in the pictures, no one in the background, but the flash sparked controversy. The ppl that saw it freaked, the DM checked the footage including before and after picts to confirm, but that wasn't enough for the rest of the ppl that attended. They were shunned by that group. I see them occasionally at vanilla events of mutu interests, but they dont do lifestyle events anymore.

How many stories can any of us tell of such incidents? Sometimes the problem is one person, a couple, a group, and sometimes its ppl gaslight or cry wolf.

I'm not trying to be a smart ass or armchair critic but can you boil down what you're trying to ask about? From what it looks like now you seem to be calling for some kind of "Governing Council" for the BDSM community.

If that's the case and of course if I weren't "retired" from the physical aspect of this crap I'd vote a hard "No". While indeed there are bad actors out there--- not just in the BDSM community but just about anywhere humans are involved. No one needs a governing council's noses in one's bedroom or private life.

But never mind all that... It begs the ages-old question, "Who watches the Watchers?"

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I might be misreading your intent, Talon guy... that's why I asked if you can drill down to the basics of that you mean and get rid of the tangents such as:

Who cares or should care about the Coffee House Gay Guy who was never seen with another man. That's his business. He ought not be required to prove his sexual preference save for anyone with whom he may interact socially and romantically.

Thanks and again, I'm not trying to be a smart ass or dime-store critic.





M

This was written for the ppl that keep asking about it and anyone that could. If its gonna happen itd be by popular vote and no one cares enough about it to do that

Talion, I personally believe your phrasing a couple aspects poorly. And I think your heart and intent is in the right place.

You at one point stated, this needs to happen. To which I say no. And I'm not interested in handing control of my personal sovereignty over to some council by popular vote of people I don't know. Especially not in regards to some form of punitive action. I think Miki elaborated the reasons why particularly well.

I am not saying its a bad idea. But I will say, as Miki has said, your call to action is too broad. Councils and regulations are good. Sometimes. When they are at their best is when they represent the expertise to do specific things correctly. They are educational with regulations showing the proper way to do things. And they represent quality with through their standards and stamps of approval. They are a place to go, when someone wants an expected outcome. This is why a council for rigging works. Its dangerous work. And there's proper ways to tie knots with proper rope selection to boot. There are ways to do it right.

A general council for BDSM that sleuths around to find the 'correct' answer to community disruptions or 'brand bad actors' though would be an over extension of that. Imagine trials. Officers. Judges. Some form or method for enforcement. That's a lot. And I'm not looking for a third government past the federal and the states breathing down my neck.

I also clash with your diction that people don't care enough. People care. A lot. But there's a solid reason we haven't done this in the vanilla dating scene. Lists of bad actors tend to be corrupted by quick judgments, differing perspectives, and retribution hits from slighted parties. Relationships are messy. A guy raping a girl? Not messy. But also not something we should be enforcing. That's a federal crime. For real cops and judges. Not our internet and hearsay bullshit.

There's a place and form for what you are proposing. And nothing stops it from happening. There's private chat groups all over the place. I'm sure a number of subs already talk and pass around notes about whose shitty around here. I have moral pro's and cons for that slip of paper, but my point is without real governmental power to enforce and punish there will always be people like me who aren't on the in enough to trust who holds the hammer.

For everything written theres too much that can be taken outnof context. As I had thought the examples wouldvenprooven, crap happens and no one cares. Good ppl get crapped on and no one cares. The whole community gets to be filled with crap ppl and ppl talk, but they're all too lazy to do something about it

I'm not sure what you mean by out of context. I at least will need more clarity on that subject.

I can only guess some conversation or event has occurred behind the scenes that has compelled you towards action. You seem closed to the idea that your proposition in this form is insufficient to meet the needs of everyone housed within this lifestyle. And I genuinely hope that further conversation occurs to edge this closer to that goal.

I will reject your statement that the community is filled with crap people who are lazy. You have no idea how hard others are working. You're cause is not necessarily their cause. By your logic, you yourself are lazy for not supporting others causes. I am attempting to convey something about your methods here. Flies with honey.

By your diction, I can only guess you desire a split in the community. If this is true. Make your own space. Fill it with like minded people. Make it useful. If others find it useful they will gather to it by value of its merit. If you want the world to change, you have to be the first one to change. Otherwise it is ironic to call the masses terrible and lazy without action yourself.

You are a strong member of this community Talion. Have been for years. This should be possible for you to at least start the ball rolling.

I will cut myself from further discussion on this matter. The discussion has merit. I do not wish to sideline it.

While bdsm, and kink, fetish activity is mostly illegal activity, not all, but increasingly the nanny state governments are making more and more activity illegal, there can be no higher anything, because the law, and social, cultural is against anything, and anyone who is outside the norm. Going to the police, or trying to get any of the bad stuff dealt with, by that higher legal authority is very difficult, for individuals, and would be by any idea of a governing body, which is why so much happens that is never dealt with, people who should be behind bars for crimes within the kink world aren't. This is also true, of sexual crimes within the vanilla sphere. This whole area of SA, needs dealt with properly, within the law, policing, and it isn't, so what hope is there for any idea of a community group.

There can't be anything while what it is we do is illegal.