Quote: But I don’t try to manipulate
Everyone manipulates. You control an event to find out information for example. Manipulation isn't "lies" or "Deceit". It often gets a bad rep because it's misused as such. But everyone wants something. And in the end we do use that to our advantage (and theirs). While being clear as possible, ideally. You're saying you don't manipulate (which is false) because of your fear of such manipulation being (mis)used for harmful purposes.
Quote: I don’t manipulate people into doing things that they don’t want to do. To me that would be unethical
There's what we want. What we don't want. Then there's the fact people don't even know what they want, or otherwise being conflicted despite the fact they made bold claims either way. Everyone manipulates without meaning too all the time without even realising it. Without control and direction being given. So it's something very important to remain aware of. What's unethical is how people assume the worst too easily. Yes, I want something from you. Yes, I want something out of this. Yes, I will try to manipulate the situation so that you benefit from it. Which is only possible if you let me more often then not. But they have to let you. More then that they have to let themselves. What is refereed to as hypnosis is basically another way of stating "Acting on subconscious/instinct". Which people tend to fear is bad when phrased as such (due to a fear of loss of control and thinking). But if you think about it many of the best things that happen also come from letting ourselves "flow" in situations. Many none hypnosis focused situations can still very much involve this. But without someone on either side of the fence guiding (manipulating) a situation there can be harm and danger. If someone is careless and puts themselves (or you) in danger because of that, that is a situation that should be manipulated in the interest of safety. Regardless of wherever it is wanted or not. There is a balance between "controlling events" without "deciding for them" though. Long story short, never decide for others but your actions are still your own. if for example someone complains about what you do that is "shaming". Did they MEAN to do it? (and thus manipulated) I'm less concerned when there's intent (thus, it's more ethical, even if unpleasant). Much more concerned when people don't even know what they're doing (eg: They could be letting a bully target you. And not even be aware they're allowing this to happen). So if we're talking about ethics first establish the lesser of two evils. We don't always get what we want. But the question is do we get what we need? eg: the old saying of "A sub doesn't get what they want, they get what they need" (provided a dom knows what they're doing with said sub). Of which doing things the other doesn't want may require. In the interest of further having them make a choice. Ethics or not "Their decision". Ethics or not are they going with the "flow" of the situation?
Also worth noting people LET themselves get into unpleasant situations all the time as well (wherever it's worth it or not in the end depends on a number of factors). I assure you, the mind has a built in "stupidity" switch as much as a "get out of danger" one. The real question is how often does such danger actually exist instead of that being an assumption? This can all be explained with one very simple word. "Fear". If anything has hypnotized people more then anything it's probably fear. Something many people avoid. Yet something that must be faced. So part of the appeal with mindfucking? Facing the unknown. Facing fear. And, if you know what you're doing, actually managing to enjoy the situation instead of letting that fear control you. It may even be possible that only through facing such fears can you gain the most enjoyment from a situation. Of which can not be obtained from anywhere else. There's a certain attraction/intimacy when someone puts you in line yet also systemically reinforces that you're looked after and cared for (and this is 100% manipulating/controlling that situation where the one giving such direction and flow is concerned).
Quote: For instance if someone came to me and they told me they wanted me to manipulate them, that might be a different matter, but I haven’t run into that yet.
I mean, does anyone actually ask for it? People more tend to let themselves be directed as you lead. HOW you lead and with what is the most contributing factor. I suppose you could say if someone asks for orders that's asking to be manipulated. If you play a FPS computer game focused on teamwork and squads you'll notice most people want to avoid taking the leadership role. While the few that do so tend to be pretty good at it. It's a similar concept in BDSM (and out). Everyone wants that direction but how many people do the directing? But as soon as someone leads by example (let alone rank) most people are on board. As if they're "hypnotized" into it. More often then not there doesn't even need to be a discussion about ranks and orders and such. Just setting an example is enough. It's also pretty easy for subs to engage with doms as well because of this. Provided a dom "leads" the sub "follows" and things "just happen". As long as that is in a "style" that is in a subs area (eg: they could be the type to require a more firm handed/forceful approach or the "softer" type). If someone engages with you unasked for yet not unwelcome while seeing to your needs easily is that not an act of manipulation?
The best kind of mindfuck is when you don't have to state your needs yet get them met. Some people can "read" you that well I suppose. It's like they're a "mind reader". hence the term "Mind" fucking.