Abuse vs protocol

Phanes​(dom male) • Nov 15, 2018

@bunnie
This seems to be going in circles. Peace out.

Cithaeria • Nov 15, 2018

The abuser and the abused. It’s very painful to stand by and watch this happen and it happens all too often.
The only way I see to combat it is to talk about it. And talk more.
Abusers don’t like to be called out and most of the time victims don’t realize they are until they are in so deep that they can’t see a clear path out.
Intelligent and respected individuals that continue to shine a bright light on the common themes that abusers use to lure their victims helps reduce the number of abusers. It makes them either change their tactics or retreat into the shadows.
Victims need a continual flow of information and support. Most victims don’t even realize they are victims, so really identifying clear and concise actions of abusers is of paramount importance. It is a grey area and it is up to the individuals who really have the knowledge to break it down into specific actions and reactions so that these emotional leeches are sent on their way.
Unfortunately, confrontation doesn’t work very well and often sends the abuser and abused running straight back to each other.
I hope to see this thread continue because the devastation of mental, emotional and physical abuse committed under the guise of bdsm protocol is disgusting. It ruins lives and makes it even more difficult to trust even the most trustworthy.

Savida​(other female) • Nov 15, 2018

@Cithaeria

Hear, hear!

I know I am often silenced , gaslighted, or belittled when I try to speak on my experience here. I’ve experienced the things you reference.

People run away from, or bow out of these conversations, or try to make it out as though those who try to have them are being tiresome. It frustrates me to no end to see this—we are supposed to care for each other and to help, not ignore, victim blame or ignore uncomfortable truths under the flimsy guise of civility or niceness.

Bunnie • Nov 15, 2018

@ Sav... I’m always happy to discuss things until it reaches the point of the same people stepping in and bullying everyone... that’s when I leave. Thanks. If you hadn’t noticed, I was quite happily discussing the topic... as were others. I’m not discussing this further... dig as much as you like. As I said previously... this is an all-too-familiar turn.

MasterBear​(other butch) • Nov 16, 2018

@Cithaeria


Thank you for this.

Yes, I absolutely agree with you on all points.


@Bunnie

I am so sorry that you are silenced.
Please help me here- I dont see attacks, what am I missing ?
Personally I want to hear what you have to say.


@Savida


I am so sorry that you are not validated.
I came off fet because it became overwhelmingly toxic.


I like hearing what you have to say.

Savida​(other female) • Nov 16, 2018

Aww Master Bear, I really appreciate you following up.

I hear you on your experience with fetlife—This place has honestly become that way for me at times—toxic and not fun in the ways it used to be. The devaluing and belittling of my genuine experiences with abuse from people here has been a huge part of why I don’t feel as welcome on the cage as I used to, and why I’ve been quieter than I was in the past. And I hate that, because this used to be my home. I grew so much being engaged in this community.

But people like you, who are genuinely kind and conscientiousness help me remember that this place has good spots as well as bad. Maybe I can find a way back.

Miss Magdalena​(sub female){FreeSpirit} • Nov 16, 2018

@ Masterbear,
I really enjoyed reading through the entirety of this forum. I think there is a general consensus of what is abuse to some, is not to others which is all well in good. From my personal experience, until you’re experienced and have an understanding of yourself, and of what a healthy relationship is, it’s hard to actually KNOW what is healthy and what is not. That’s just how I see it.
I think a lot of people, be it online or in person, will experience various forms of abuse, because when we step out in the world, we largely don’t know what we are getting into, and we will meet people we never dreamed possible. No amount of books can prepare you really, for what hormones, chemicals in the brain, and feelings can do to your mind and your body. How it can turn a relatively sensible person, into someone impulsive, someone willing to take risks, someone determined to find something fulfilling. I think it’s probably fair to say, that until you see or experience what unhealthy is, you probably won’t really know for sure.
That being said, I agree with what is being said. I am not necessarily one who enjoys physical pain and things of that nature, but I do enjoy a mental battle of wills and submitting to someone that can challenge me and bend me with their mind. I KNOW there is a degree of manipulation there, though knowingly, and it’s extremely exciting, or can be for some. Manipulation has a negative connotation to it, but it doesn’t always have to be so. I feel when you have a pretty good sense of self, you KNOW when your will is being molded or shaped, and for some, that is a very exciting thing. However, like anything like this, there is a level of danger there, which is why communication, trust, and building that foundation before you allow those things is so important. But again, I think it’s incredibly difficult to truly understand just HOW important those are, until you experience some form of loss, abuse, hurt, or some other kind of growing pain.
I hate being the one to say that in this life, hurt is inevitable, but honestly, it is. You can’t appreciate the value of something good until you understand what is bad. I truly believe that. I think a lot of people are going to get hurt, but even though that inevitability is there, it doesn’t change the fact that having friends, community, and resources can lessen or help that process for us all.
Having forum posts like this, is so helpful. Seeing people openly discussing consent vs abuse and what the difference is to them, is extremely important. Trying to differentiate between the two, and understanding that, to do that, in my opinion, is based largely on the individual(s), having a true understanding of ourself (self-awareness), and being able to have honest discussions with our partner. I think we often lie to ourselves and that creates huge problems, in any given situation.
We can’t just look at something on the surface and determine the validity and legitimacy of it’s depth and value. We also know, that there is a very real chance people will get hurt, be it through lies, bad forms of manipulation, and other sorts of mind fuckery. That is the chance everyone of us takes, when we open ourselves up to anyone we meet, and when we allow others inside.

Bunnie • Nov 16, 2018

@ Miss Magdalena, great post

MasterBear​(other butch) • Nov 16, 2018

@Miss Magdalena,


That was awesome.

Thank you for the post!!!

MasterBear​(other butch) • Nov 16, 2018

@Savida

Thank you so much.

I really enjoy your input.

It matters.