Is the 'ed' on "transgendered" offensive or misleading?

Lucia​(sub female){not lookin} • Dec 10, 2017

@whitesubuk: "Why not just accept and like the person for their character? for who they are as a person? as opposed for the id-entity that is assumed upon them with all the various labels."

To keep this post on topic, the practical question was words used on this website for trans folks. The question OP raised was the now-corrected use of a term that is commonly considered offensive on the forum section for trans members. Some of us thought that using a term known to be offensive to folks was a failure to accept them. The discussion wasn't "how to label a transgender person" because we were trying to assume identities onto them, but how to accommodate the identity that IS them already, how to accommodate those who actively wish to label themselves or post in a labeled forum that is meant to apply to them and can't do it properly. What you're forgetting maybe is that some folks here WISH to label themselves as part of putting themselves out here on the site for acceptance. For many (trans and otherwise), gender/sexual ID labels have been such a strong part of forming their personhood that being accepted for their "core" as you put it requires being accepted for those labels.

That's how I feel about being a woman; it's completely integral to explaining who, how, and why I am me. For me, I'd be lost thinking about how to ask someone to accept Lucia the human without considering Lucia the woman. It seems clear from your post that that isn't your personal feeling about your own gender, and I in return accept and think that's wonderful for you. Meanwhile, for those of us who feel differently, identifying with labels that reinforce the most personal parts of ourselves is strengthening and self-affirming, not something that is imposed upon us. Therefore, the site should make chosen and proud self-identification equally simple for all members. The concern was not using the right phrasings to explain trans folks to the world, but offering the right phrasings for trans folks to explain themselves to us, if they so choose.

Also considering the Cage as a "dating" site, it's important for folks to be able to adequately explain things that factor into compatibility. Thus the point I raised of trans folks at different stages of physical transition being able to identify differently (for example "mtf" being a woman in transition who may have a penis versus "trans female" being a woman who may have a pussy). Those are important things that some people want to make loud and clear about themselves in the context of this website.

Lucia​(sub female){not lookin} • Dec 10, 2017

@hawkeye The initial issue was that the forum section for trans folks was labeled "Transgendered". That word used to label a human being, out of the context of a sentence, grammatically implies that transgender is something a person "becomes" or is "turned into". Since transgender is a core physical, psychological, and mental identity, that implication has long been considered offensive. It would be like referring to a gay person all the time as a "gay-ed" person. Like, that person is "being gay-ified"; there is a third party just out of view who is doing something to make them gay. But actually, gay folks are just gay. Trans folks are just trans. So the right word is just "transgender". That person is transgender. Not "that person is being transgendered." Hope that makes sense.

DRHierophant​(dom trans man) • Dec 13, 2017

Personally, I don't give two coins either way because I understand that there are a ton of misconceptions/assumptions/miseducation about transfolk; and ->trans-trenders<- don't contribute anything to those of us that just want to try and lead normal lives as -who we are-.
That being said, 'Transgendered' can sometimes feel uncomfortable because of what we were born as and the fact that it feels very wrong to be that way.
It's that -thing- we can't change. We aren't 'transgendered' we are 'a man' or 'a woman' (or other identities if you prefer it that way).

For those of you who don't understand what it is to be transgender, the best way I can explain it as.... you wake up one day, so suddenly, not knowing who or where you are. You're in a dark room, you fumble around, searching for your lamp switch in panic. To find something familiar in a dark situation, we usually reach out for what's most familiar to us, or think about things we know undoubtedly. Usually ourselves or our immediate life; objects even. But for sake of the explanation, you pinch yourself to make sure you're still alive. Still real. That it's not all some f*cked up dream.

You feel the pain. Alright. This is good. You're not dead. But why's it so dark?

You keep fumbling around until you feel the rough little knob on the lamp; then you flip it on. Your fingernails are painted? The f*ck is this? Hopping out of bed, you realize you're wearing a dress and you wonder what drunk ass party you'd come from. Then you hesitate. You got something on your chest. You're missing something between your legs. Dread courses through you and you whirl toward the mirror attached to your door and you find yourself staring at a 5' 7" brunette woman with hip to share.

It's at this moment that you realize you're not a 24 year old male attending college with mad skill in rugby, dating a slim, blond-headed, red-lipped babe in the 20s.

Your memories of that life come rushing back to you and a mesh of hatred, pain, and dismay replace whatever happiness you had. In your day to day life, you have to face -every single thing- that is -not you-. Something so simple as going to the bathroom or engaging in relationships beyond friends is agonizing.

And it's not just -this- thing or -that- thing. It's all things large and small.

You don't give children, you bear them, you don't stand to pee, you sit, you don't carry large objects, you step aside and 'let the big men do it'. You aren't pressured into college, you can make yourself comfortable at home. You deal with the shame of a body that's really not your own... there's a missing piece and a couple other pieces you don't need. Et cetera, et cetera... (there is just too much to put down.)

What would you do? What would you think? If you woke up one day and you had a woman's body? Or the other way around? Think about that for a minute. Truly if someone strapped you to a table and gave you a bodily overhaul, what would that feel like? What would it feel like if you were forced into the role -with- that new body?
***
Needless to say, I'll hop off my soapbox and hope that this makes some sort of sense to someone. I, by no means, am speaking for the trans-status-quo, but it is my perspective on the (rather painful) experience I've had to-date. And probably too long of an explanation for the original 'transgendered' inquiry. Though since I was reading through comments, I decided to post with hopes it might shed a little light on things.

Sorry for the babbling folks.

Cheers.

Lucia​(sub female){not lookin} • Dec 13, 2017

DRHierophant​, not babbling at all- thank you SO much for sharing! There's no such thing as too long of an explanation when actually hearing from you instead of us, and that was some damned fine writing to boot, so no complaints here!

And you have my sincerest apologies if my comments or the presence of this whole thread were just something in your way of being here and enjoying The Cage, I see you're new. Welcome! It's often fun and not this pedantic.

DRHierophant​(dom trans man) • Dec 13, 2017

It is not an obstacle to me in any way! I enjoy shedding light in the subject, that being said, I forgot to define what a trans-trender is! Transtrender=a trans-person who changes because it's the new 'fad', they are usually the 'look at me, I'm trans!!' kind if people. (And yes... I have met plenty...) They are typically ready to unload their problems onto others and usually are ready to do verbal combat. (Again, not saying that this is the status quo but something I have noticed in the majority). Transgender=a man or a woman with an upside down reality that just wants to be who they are (usu. incognito) and to be left alone to live their lives in happiness.

Lady Pheonix​(dom female) • Dec 13, 2017

In the UK the separation was made between different classifications legally.
Under UK law, Transexual is someone who is or needs medical assistance to correct faulty birth gender. They are usually under the medical system, have access to meds and surgery.
Transgender refers to someone who chooses to live in the opposite gender, but for any reason decides not to follow he path to a full gender re-assignment.

in recent years, because people have not learned the difference it has led to people being arrested and locked up in the wrong jails.

It is also true that in the UK the law was changed to allow birth gender listed on a birth certificate to be changed. Once legal status has been changed to the newly assigned gender, it is illegal to refer to the old gender for that person. It has been listed as a hate crime under UK and European law.

Not only that, but the right to gender identity is now a UN listed basic human right!!

MyWimpslut​(sub male) • Dec 13, 2017

Speaking as someone with no first hand knowledge and perhaps offering a view from those that don't fully understand.
I suspect it's derived from someones attempt to label the condition from a medical text book rather than form the experience of someone with the physical condition.
Sometimes people are born into the wrong body, perhaps suggesting they are transgender is in some ways saying that they were born into the right gender and now wish to transformto another.

I know Dr John William Money performed an experiment to prove his theory that from a gender perspective we are all blank sheets of paper, he kept some of his findings in the dark to make it look like it was a success rather than the disaster it was. Also there's the sexually dimorphic nucleus an area of the brain larger in males than in females. Analysis of the cross sections from people who had themselves donated to medical science hose who transitioned M to F and vice versa had the sexually dimorphic nucleus of the gender that they had been re-assigned.

In face of growing medical facts perhaps it's time to confront something contrived out of ignorance.
Is Caitlyn Jenner still bosom budies with Trump, he let her use the bathroom at Trump tower.

androidboy​(sub trans man) • Dec 14, 2017

Or a "transtrender" is a baby trans person who needs support? You can't separate the two like this lol. If I saw a person who was 17 and acting like a "transtrender", not sure I'd be so quick to dismiss them. Potential trans people need support from the trans community, for gods sake, not some catchy label to tell them that they're faking.

Same concerns that have been raised already - I definitely prefer trans guy to trans ftm, it leaves a bit of an icky taste in my mouth, but I'm sort of forced to choose it when there's no other option.

I'd be glad to have a box to write in my own identity, or maybe we could be allowed to pick multiple boxes? So one could pick both genderqueer and trans guy, etc.

Also flagging that "intersexed" is kind of fucked up for the same reasons "transgendered is".

I'm really glad that staff are okay to listen, it's really heartening.

Lucia​(sub female){not lookin} • Dec 14, 2017

**Cutting in with inappropriate joke**

@androidboy, do you consider android a sexuality, gender or something else? It seems to go very hand in hand with being genderqueer although I wouldn't want to impose stereotypes on anyone. If it IS a sexuality (which I would take to mean you are only attracted to androids) we need to lobby for you to get an android forum. There's certainly no way for androids to self-identify at the top of their profiles.

ANYWAY. Fuuuck me, I didn't even notice "intersexed"... that is definitely the exact same problem.

And huzzah UK! In the US we forget how behind we are.

And I guess the only way to tell a trender from a baby is to know them. With situations like that I try to approach everyone with the benefit of the doubt even if I have a really strong feeling that they're bullshit. Sometimes internal shame manifests that way. EVERYONE in the BDSM community should be familiar with being disappointed by fake members of their community.... but needs to remember that babies can make mistakes and education about a very vast world is not always available to those who are truly a part of it. But when you do identify a transtrender for sure, I highly recommend completely eviscerating them. Giving a bad name to a community that is going through real shit is not an acceptable way to work out that your mommy didn't put enough of your work on the fridge.

Lady Pheonix​(dom female) • Dec 14, 2017

The singular reality of gender dysphoria and gender dysmorphia is that it is a life long struggle for those who live with it.

Though the treatment for both, at the moment is exactly the same, these are two different issues that even the medical profession has not yet come to terms with. Because of this, many people are mislabelled either by the law, or by the doctors. I think this has helped with the idea that 'trans' is trendy.

Not only that, but with high profile cases, loaded with cash, make the system look deceptively easy, whilst hiding the struggles, heartache and pain that many go through.

Don't want to be jumping on peoples toes, but, if the medical world cant bloomin well figure it out, then the ONLY way to deal with people is one on one.

and hey, do not forget, MANY people are great when there is a screen in the way, but when it happens in your family, or to someone you love, often people walk away from someone who has spent years, or decades, struggling to conform in a world that will occasionally shun them as a "freak"!

#loveforlove