Literate Lycan(dom male)
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2 years ago •
Jun 25, 2022
As I just finished working out which means I am somewhat feeling primal and jocular, I will note of the entire bunch responding (definitely including me) not one of us is or ever was directly Old Guard. For the most part, we've all literally googled it (or perhaps in one or two cases heard it second hand from someone in real life at a munch or dungeon or at the grocery store . . . but doesn't even sound like any of us heard it first hand nor actually lived it). My point . . . for those who have recently claimed to actually be Old Guard, why in heavens aren't they responding to this forum post? My initial and quite aggressive assumption is that they aren't Old Guard at all.
So in summation and again returning to the original forum post, I don't know of any new guard really. I've heard of but have zero experience with Old Guard. I did use Right Guard when I was younger. Now I prefer Old Spice, which is completely different I am certain we can all agree. Even among the Subject Matter Experts in the lifestyle who chimed in above, who I do actually respect and read what they write and pay attention to it, we don't have a common consensus. But if you've recently or ever been approached by someone claiming to be Old Guard on this site, I would ask why aren't they providing a definition and assist in our understanding? The answer is most probably they aren't Old Guard and are claiming a title. Or perhaps in some cases, may be claiming a title not understanding it fully but just figuring, "Hey, I'm in the lifestyle. I'm at least 22. I've been doing this a good few months now . . . I must be Old Guard, right?" All the Best. |
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Online now
SirsBabyDoll(sub female){Pizza+☕}
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2 years ago •
Jun 25, 2022
@Literate Lycan,
We both know someone who used to be here that was trained in the Leather Houses and knows about Old v. New Guard through his training there. Granted, his mentor died before he received his hat but I wish he was still here so could chim in. Drago. |
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Sweetlydepraved(masochist female){I Guess }
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2 years ago •
Jun 25, 2022
LL,
Deodorant really can be inspiring, just look at what it did for Nirvana. Maybe that’s the secret to dominance! |
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dollMaker(dom male)
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2 years ago •
Jun 26, 2022
SirsBabyDoll wrote: @Literate Lycan,
We both know someone who used to be here that was trained in the Leather Houses and knows about Old v. New Guard through his training there. Granted, his mentor died before he received his hat but I wish he was still here so could chim in. Drago. I have no idea who that is, but surely its possible to continue via a leather community, their previous earned leather might go towards earning their cap (if their mentor was known and respected in that community) surely they don't have to start from scratch? It would strike me as very unfair and a flawed approach if that was the case. |
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SirsBabyDoll(sub female){Pizza+☕}
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2 years ago •
Jun 26, 2022
dollMaker wrote: SirsBabyDoll wrote: @Literate Lycan,
We both know someone who used to be here that was trained in the Leather Houses and knows about Old v. New Guard through his training there. Granted, his mentor died before he received his hat but I wish he was still here so could chim in. Drago. I have no idea who that is, but surely its possible to continue via a leather community, their previous earned leather might go towards earning their cap (if their mentor was known and respected in that community) surely they don't have to start from scratch? It would strike me as very unfair and a flawed approach if that was the case. DaddyDrago (and Lil Amythist)...and he finished his training but his Master died before being able to formally give it to him. He left the leather community after that I think (don't quote me on that though). |
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I'mME
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2 years ago •
Jun 27, 2022
KrazyChaos wrote: Honestly... I'd be wary of someone touting "old guard".
Kink us customizable and there is no "right" or "wrong" way to be a sub. A lot of "old guard" comes from the beliefs in the gor books. Which are fiction. That would be no different than me going around saying I have to see someone in sunlight to see if they're a vampire because I believe the twilight books. Or that every Dom MUST be an abused millionaire because that's what's in 50 shades. I am going to disagree with your statement that ''Old Guard'' comes from Gor books. They have nothing to do with each other. Old Guard started with gay men after WW II. I am providing a link to something written by Guy Baldwin. He thinks that BDSM should go back to many tents. Jack Rinella has opposing views. I leave that for people to decide themselves. https://www.evilmonk.org/a/oldguard.cfm I am not sure why people keep trying to reinvent the wheel. If you want to add a new rim, fancy color, some led lights, great. I always think the roots and history of something is important, it doesn't mean I think everyone should follow the Old Guard, it just means learn the why and where and pass it on. Confusion, physical and emotional injury is what occurs when people just jump in without any background. |
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I'mME
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2 years ago •
Jun 27, 2022
moll wrote: KrazyChaos wrote: Honestly... I'd be wary of someone touting "old guard".
Kink us customizable and there is no "right" or "wrong" way to be a sub. A lot of "old guard" comes from the beliefs in the gor books. Which are fiction. That would be no different than me going around saying I have to see someone in sunlight to see if they're a vampire because I believe the twilight books. Or that every Dom MUST be an abused millionaire because that's what's in 50 shades. NO! Old Guard does not come from Gor books. It started before Norman started writing his books in the mid 1960s. Old Guard comes from returning homosexual GIs that created Leather families after serving in the military in World War II, late 1940s. They experienced protocols, discipline, and hierarchies while serving and created families and communities with those tenants in mind. THIS IS what can occur when people just aren't curious to ever look in the past. ❤️ Many people who live the Gor lifestyle do not practice BDSM. |
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I'mME
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2 years ago •
Jun 27, 2022
moll wrote: DrWakko wrote: Old Guard came from the those that started leather clubs back in the late 1940 early 1950. The Old Guard were men who came back from WW2 and missed the comradery of military service. They formed motorcycle groups to start. They then opened clubs like Hellfire and The Eagle. The first three homes of Old Guard and Leather were SF, NY and Chicago. Clubs had a set of rules. From my understanding the most common was the uniform. Tops wore boots, jean, white shirts and leather vests. Bottoms wore boots, jeans, and a leather vest. You had to earn the role as Top everyone started as a bottom.
Women were not allowed into these clubs till the mid 60s. And as a joke a Leatherman out Chicago (I believe) started the hanky code. Almost all of these Old Guard are dead. A lot of them didn’t make it past the AIDS epidemic of the 1980s. Now a day there are few who carry on Old Guard tradition, but they have tweaked it to their own. For those that want to know more about Leather and Old Guard I suggest checking out the Leather Museum And Archive in Chicago. DW It wasn't just the comradery. It was mostly the discipline, the protocols, and the hierarchy that they experienced while serving in the military during WWII. Motorcycle clubs were mostly men who enjoyed the "open road" and didn't want to go back to "normal" civilian life. And they eventually branched off from MC bars. |
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I'mME
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2 years ago •
Jun 27, 2022
Bunnie wrote: Something I’m a little unsure of is why it matters if “Old Guard” or “traditionalist” ways are strict or rigid. Some people like structure and strictness and rules and rigidity and tradition.
It gets a little tiring to be told that those preferences are “one-true-wayist” when all we’re doing is following something that feels right for us. What makes my ways “one-true-wayist” and not yours? Because they don’t fit right for you? I do detest ''One TWUE WAY'' . LOL, joking with you a bit. Kissing aside, Bunnie, that notion can also slide over to those who s'make statements like ''To be Old Guard you have to be over 100 and gay. '' Seems to be a bit of one true way on both sides topics at times. What do you think? |
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I'mME
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2 years ago •
Jun 27, 2022
moll wrote: DrWakko wrote: I know Leather Folk in probably close to two dozen communities around the US in well over a dozen states and I've been part of the BDSM community for over 20 years now... Its a pretty safe bet that my comment is correct.
Apparently we don't know the same people. Thanks for such an interesting conversation. Leather groups descended directly from a mix of Old Guard. |
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