Old vs new guard

Old vs new guard

new Luna​(sub female) • Jun 22, 2022

As I have been speaking to several Doms this has come up and to be honest I am still a little confused

Question is ;

what is the difference between Old Guard and New Guard Dom's?

Some like to remind me they are of the old guard which means nothing to a newbie, but I would like to know more about it please

Literate Lycan​(dom male) • Jun 22, 2022

I would recommend you do a quick search on Old Guard and BDSM. You’ll see a treasure trove of information on the topic, including conjecture on origin and development of protocols and characteristics, most of which revolved around mentorship to learn from the “Old Guard” to the new members. I have zero direct knowledge of the subject. I have my own thoughts.

Heero​(dom male) • Jun 22, 2022

Based on your other forum post, I am (only slightly) concerned about these Doms you're talking to...though it may just be a generational thing.

To give a very non-comprehensive, grossly over simplified answer:

Old Guard = very strict/traditional/militaristic/more demanding/"high protocol" style of BDSM.

New Guard = more casual/modern/less demanding/"low protocol" style of BDSM.

The history of these types of protocols go back decades. You say it means "nothing" to a newbie and while it can be important/desired to know your history, I would tend to agree with you--in the following sense.

Practically speaking, for either protocol, what is expected of you should be made clear and you should consent to it. Knowing or not knowing the tradition behind the rules you're given isn't practically relevant in this sense. You just consent if you're into it and don't if you're not.

But generally if someone tells you they're high protocol, they're either trying to communicate they're "very strict" or posturing like they are.

Some references with some history, but you can find more via Google:

https://www.kinkly.com/definition/10146/old-guard

https://www.kinkweekly.com/article-baadmaster/old-guard-vs-new-guard/

https://www.fetish.com/magazine/bdsm/what-is-old-guard/

LongerJohnny​(dom male){B&C} • Jun 22, 2022

Old/New guard differences and similarities can be summed up like this:
Each thinks that the crap the other listens to isn't "real" music.
I hope that helps.

Sweetlydepraved​(masochist female){95%} • Jun 22, 2022

Also, some will use to term Old Guard to lend themselves false legitimacy. “I’m Old Guard, trust me, that means that I know what I’m doing.” It doesn’t.

Bunnie • Jun 22, 2022

MAsT is a great community to look into if you’re interested in learning about what could be considered “Old Guard” ways. Also the Leather community. To those who have actually practiced in a community off-line, and aren’t just using that term as a “catchphrase” to suck in newbies, it is a *way of life* that is based on respect, honour, integrity, truth and probably the defining factor between “old” and “new”… tradition. There are “ways” that are passed on through training or mentoring, in-person, that are believed to be fundamental to living that type of lifestyle.
As someone who does prefer to follow a more traditional path, I don’t have an issue with “new”… if it comes from a place of knowledge and understanding of the roots in which it is founded on. What often happens though, is people shun tradition without actually understanding it. That’s when we see the problems of “the ignorant leading the ignorant.”

KrazyChaos​(sub female) • Jun 22, 2022

Honestly... I'd be wary of someone touting "old guard".
Kink us customizable and there is no "right" or "wrong" way to be a sub.
A lot of "old guard" comes from the beliefs in the gor books. Which are fiction. That would be no different than me going around saying I have to see someone in sunlight to see if they're a vampire because I believe the twilight books. Or that every Dom MUST be an abused millionaire because that's what's in 50 shades.

SirsBabyDoll​(sub female){Pizza+☕} • Jun 22, 2022

I would definitely be careful when dealing with Old Guard. Each House has different ideals and unless you understand what really constitutes Old Guard, you can't figurw out who is a fake and who isn't.

I wouldn't consent to ANYTHING or treat a Dom with deference until you are fully educated (by someone OTHER than that Dom). Do your homework! Research, Research, research! Learn as much as you can about a variety of kinks without actually participating in those kinks.

You want to get to a point where all this isn't quiet so new. You want to be able to start a conversation with someone and be able to recognize the bullshitters just from talking to them. So many use those terms (as SweetlyDepraved said) to legitimatize themselves and make themselves sound important.

Literate Lycan​(dom male) • Jun 22, 2022

Although I do agree I would recommend being wary of anyone touting they are Old Guard, New Guard, Right Guard or Left Guard in the first few communications, I believe the history of the "Old Guard" comes from the leather community stemming from returning soldiers circa 1940s to 1950s (WW II era). Gorean Novels came out in 1966 and gave the foundation for the Gorean Lifestyle practices, also within the BDSM community.

Again, not in any fashion knowledgable of the Old Guard beyond what I've read or heard.

KrazyChaos​(sub female) • Jun 22, 2022

Interesting to know.... thanks!

And totally agree... wary of anyone saying that there is a right or wrong way to be or what someone should know