Feminism: Has it gone too far?

Feminism: Has it gone too far?

Dom Pinnacle​(dom male) • May 14, 2023

Has feminism changed the submissive nature of women? Has it possibly made women much more in tune with their masculine energy than they should be?

Do naturally submissive women feel ashamed or hesitant in expressing themselves around brow beating feminists?

Has feminism chipped away at mens masculinity to the point of making them feel obligated champion feminism? Feeling guilty about being a man?

I believe in fairness among the sexes. But are we now experiencing toxic femininity on a high level? Just some thoughts I've had recently. Look forward to hearing your perspectives on this.

boundforlove​(sub male) • May 15, 2023

I was talking to a friend who brought up a topic similar to this. She was telling me about how her family basically has always been run by dominant women, or at least up to her grandmother. Whether it fits a narrative or not, there have always been women who prefer dominance just as there are many that prefer submission. Some women, of course, may show this differently than many men. Basically, what I'm getting at is that it's possible that the women you're observing are simply more comfortable expressing themselves publicly than the generations prior. Do some overcompensate? Of course, but that's the case for both sexes and always has been. Moreover, you are right that society affects how people act and it does create pressures, but how are you to determine at which point we are at homeostasis, assuming that even exists?

Furthermore, you're talking about how women may be more masculine than they "should be," and I think that line of thinking is flawed. If a woman has masculine energy, who sets the bar to what she is allowed to express in order for it to be societally acceptable? Should we not simply allow people to have the energy they possess and share it with the world, as that is a gift in and of itself? You may not like certain energies from certain people, but no one is forcing you to be friends with anyone; you have the ability to choose those that you accompany in your personal life.

I encourage you to continue to question your own biases.

simplylaura​(sub female){djinni} • May 15, 2023

I've had to sit on my hands for a little while so that I'd at least make an attempt at playing nice. Luckily, boundforlove was so much more friendly and eloquent than I will likely be, because I'm so over this line of thinking and the assumption that women are always the subs and manly men are always the doms that is pervasisve on the cage. Let's not even mention how you didn't even consider for a second that other genders exist and that women don't exist just to submit to men.

"Brow beating feminist" SUBMISSIVE here. Yeah, we exist. And guess what? Most submissives that I've met (and in my 20 years of being engaged in real life communities I've met a million of them) are not these quaking flowers of femininity that your antiquated gender essentialist biases assume they are and are in fact badasses who have their own minds and opinions and are most often feminists.

I am a cisgender, queer, lesbian, butch ("masc" as the youth would say) submissive woman. I have held multiple leadership roles over the course of my career, am extremely educated, and am in a field where the majority of my peers are anyone BUT cisgender men. I've been in several long term in person D/s relationships with dominant women/gender non-comforming people. I'd say I spend about 85% of my life surrounded by women. And I've never met a single one who has said that a feminist has shamed them out of exploring their submissive nature. In fact, if you put 10 lesbians in a room, I'd reckon that 7 of them would openly admit that they are bottoms in the bedroom with other women. I've spent time in radical feminist spaces and not a one has discouraged a woman (or any person) from exploring submission OR dominance.

So, if you think that women have a problem admitting their submissive nature, that sounds more like a man issue than a feminist issue to me. Figure out why men aren't acting in ways that make it safe for women to submit to them. Don't blame the people who are actually standing for women's rights and fighting against the antiquted ideals that people like you try to uphold in the name of tradition.

I think you have no idea what feminism is. Truly. You could spend literally five seconds on Google and find decent articles about the purpose and waves of feminism and feminist theory. If you did, you'd realize that feminism is about equity and intersectionality. It's about holding men accountable for harms that they perpetuate and women being able to make choices without facing life-ending consequences. If you truly believe that feminism is attempting to chip away at masculinity, you have a reeeeeeally fragile idea of what masculinity is and what feminists are trying to do, and I'm sorry that you hold masculinity in such low regard. I am very in touch with both my femininity and my masculinity and think it's laughable that people equate dominance with masculinity and submission with femininity.

I'll repeat it again, because in my vast experience in queer and same sex spaces, admitting to a submissive nature has never been shamed and has always been uplifted. So it sounds like a cis-het man problem and you should look to your own community to figure out why women don't want to submit to you. In the mean time, I think the brow beating feminists department is taking applications for both dominant and submissive people of any gender or sexuality, as long as your'e not a douchebag.

Miki • May 15, 2023

Feminism and BDSM do not mix. When I was active, and wanted to cap off a nice evening, I would make it clear that as a woman, my purpose was to satisfy my mate. Period. I am abstaining now but my point doesn't waver. I am female. My duty is to satisfy the sexual needs or desires of a male.

Dom Pinnacle​(dom male) • May 15, 2023

LMFAO...I knew it was coming. Keep em coming.

boundforlove​(sub male) • May 15, 2023

If that frivolous response is all you can manage to muster up after the responses you were given then you are no longer worth my time. Turning notifications off for this post.

djinni​(dom female){smplylaura} • May 15, 2023

And you wonder why there is a need for feminism…. Textbook toxic masculinity BS.

PandorasRose • May 15, 2023

As a disclaimer for personal bias I am a switch female that leans a little more towards Dom and am not a feminist, I'm actually a bit more right of center in my beliefs but consider myself an egalitarian.

I heard about this argument and had to give my two cents for what it's worth. I think the perception of femininity versus masculinity has been completely skewed over our history, especially in European cultures. When analysing social behaviors from a psychological standpoint, it seems that traits more associated with femininity are actually more masculine and vice versa. For instance, men appear to have very big emotions, much larger than women generally. I believe this is a reason why they are shamed out of expressing them and taught to hold them down instead, for the convenience of society. Women are SEEN as more emotional simply because we aren't shamed out of expressing our feelings like men are. This can also be seen in how men and women approach emotional issues. Women are more likely to offer comforting words but men are more likely to be quick to try and offer solutions in order to make the negative feelings go away as quickly as possible, as they're incredibly uncomfortable to sit with. This can also be seen scientifically/biologically in how women change when testosterone spikes during their menstrual cycles, the time in which they're seen as "extra sensitive" and "extra moody/emotional". The hormone which causes this is testosterone.

As for dominance vs submissiveness, I do believe as boundforlove said that people are just becoming more comfortable expressing themselves. Some men like to use their big feelings for domination purposes but others like to for doting/caretaking, which could fall into the category of either dominance or submissiveness. People are beginning to question what is natural and what feels right instead of following along with how they feel things should be, which is why this community is such a positive one. It should be about exploring yourself and dynamics that feel right to you, not placing yourself in a box or casting assumptions based on your sex or preconceived/likely flawed notions of what femininity and masculinity are themselves.

Dom Pinnacle​(dom male) • May 15, 2023

This is not about me dominating anyone at all. Just throwing that out there. And no matter how much you huff and puff, I will not argue with you. Your thoughts are your thoughts. But it's funny because I'm getting the exact responses I expected. Some don't even see their own toxicity. Carry on.

DuchessDahlia​(switch female) • May 15, 2023

He clearly lacks the maturity and mental acuity for such a layered discussion. You made salient points and he had no response, people like that like to throw rocks and hide their hands.