Are you a true Gaslighter?

LordofPain56 • Sep 4, 2020

So, the question is...are you a true gaslighter? The answer is, I'm not even a false gaslighter.
At my household there are rules which both I and the sub would be bound to. These rules are included in a document which I call "the covenant". It is submitted by both parties and finally agreed upon with whatever revisions that took place during the "courting" phase.
It is clearly stated in the rules that all lying, manipulation and deceitfulness is forbidden. Wouldn't matter what my or her personality is. Still gotta follow the rules.
But I don't have that type of personality anyway. I am a giver rather than a taker, and I am empathetic and compassionate, but emotions do not override the rules. I live a strict life of structure.

DrWakko • Sep 4, 2020

I want to go on the record about being a gaslighter:

At no time in my life have I lit or lit anyone elses fart. However I have used a match on a gas stove when the pilot light went out, this is true about the home stove as well as camping stoves.

Devotedsub​(sub female){His} • Sep 4, 2020

@LordofPain56,
Someone with a Narcissistic / Antisocial personality will present themselves in a likable way. They will agree to follow rules. They will agree to do no harm. They will be the most Charming people you will ever meet.. At first... Eventually, their true colors will show. A person who has one of these personality types will always manipulate once they gain trust. This is just how they operate. Many times, as was discussed above, people are mislabeled as one of these things and they truly aren't. Being a true narcissist or having a anti social personality isn't as common as most people portray it. People may manipulate on occasion, but that does not make them a narcissist or anti social. There are multiple factors that go into being diagnosed with one of these personalities. Chances are... You probably haven't come across anyone who has one. If you have, based on what you said about your rules (that lying, manipulation, and deceitfulness is forbidden).. I'm very sure you wouldn't tolerate these behaviors, as no one should. Btw, I think it is a great and important rule to have. 😊

shahh • Sep 4, 2020

Happens to us all from time to time and no gahhhhhhs needed lol. But showing everyone that bullsh*t won't be tolerated is always needed... especially from member of marginalized communities. You rock! Always brilliant and thoughtful and thanks for being a voice for many who can't or won't speak up 😎

Cheers!

FeistyMinx​(sub female){HAPPYL❤VE} • Sep 4, 2020

I make grammatical errors when I'm passionate about what I'm trying to say, speak and/write, LOL.
So @FeistyMinx .... Preach not peach... And the bottom line is suppose to say...
I ain't (my southern slang) got "time" to fuck with you.

@DrWakko

FeistyMinx​(sub female){HAPPYL❤VE} • Sep 4, 2020

🤦🏻‍♀️

@LordofPain56

FeistyMinx​(sub female){HAPPYL❤VE} • Sep 4, 2020

I absolutely commend you both for doing that. That is such an awesome idea. I really think that could be a game changer for all of us because the ones who are not willing to sign or if they are passive towards it then that right there should be a red light. Thank you so much!

Taramafor​(sub male) • Sep 4, 2020

What if some people that "gaslight" only make it about responsibility, including their own?

1: manipulation is another word for control. Provided it's kept honest and in the open it's not "behind your back". It's the deceit people tend to take issue with. No awareness means not knowing the choices of the situation you're in. No contract will change that. To be clear, manipulation does NOT have to involve lies or deceit. Something that's easily overlooked.

2: "Knowing your shit" doesn't mean it's easy to explain said shit. Frankly, it can get tiring. Chances are you manipulate yourself. It's why you say "nice" things. You want a "positive" result. But that has its own danger. Some people will say the hard truth for what it is. Are you to blame? Well, I make it about responsibility. If you feel like you did something wrong, then did you? finding the middle ground between "Being harsh when needed" and "Focusing on fun" isn't flipping easy. Can end easy but it can be a very shit journey people struggle with. Why don't people talk about that instead of "They're the bad guy"?

3: Those "gaslighters" that are easily seen the worst of? Maybe seeing them that way is why they're struggling to have their needs met. Perhaps they'd be more upbeat and fun if they weren't looked down on and you were actually there for them instead of being evasive and assuming the worst. Just a thought.

I find it ironic how people complain about feeling like they're to blame when they themselves are casting that blame. You do do stupid shit. No one's innocent of that. I do too. People complain and thus can be viewed as "the bad guy". Define "What, when, where, why". Adapt to the situation. Yes it can feel like "blame", but your own action/inaction is on you as much as it is on others. Frankly, I've been blamed for a suicide, but you don't see me using that as an excuse. Nope, patched things up with an ex, they turned over a new leaf. Because the blame game is counter productive. And avoiding the situation makes you a coward, not a winner.

In my experience neither side is innocent. So when I see posts about "Boo hoo, I feel like I'm too blame" then I'm asking if that feeling is there for a reason. It's not a game you're going to "win". Winning isn't the goal. The goal is understanding each other. Making the best of whatever situation you're in. Maybe it's shit right now but becomes fun because someone stops taking shit too personally. "Here's the situation. Crack a morbid joke. Onto fun and games." If you can't do that is it on them or is it your own inability to turn those situations around? That's the question I'm presenting.

Sometime people will suffer from anxiety and irrational fears. But sometimes YOU are the one fearing the worst, which means if someone is afraid of you due to, say, not putting in any time and effort as an example, then that's a concern that's validated. Speak up and you can be seen as the bad guy. Remain silent? Well, you tell me. Sometimes people wonder how they can win. And it's because they feel like losing (from your reaction most likely) that they panic.

Now imagine being the reason someone stares at the screen for six hours when you feel like you're being toyed with when in reality they're afraid YOU will get the wrong impression the moment they attempt to speak up. Which, unfortunately, can easily happen. Validating that fear only serves to drive them further into the "panic zone". But perhaps it was you that's afraid in the first place. As anger breeds anger, so too can fear breed fear.

The real danger isn't the gaslighters themselves. The real danger is that we could easily MAKE them.

SweetSirRendering​(sub female) • Sep 4, 2020

please look up gaslighting and examples of gaslighting. what you wrote is not about gaslighting.

Taramafor​(sub male) • Sep 4, 2020

I know what gaslighting is. I'm saying people can easily be VIEWED as people that harmfully manipulate.

Which, technically, they could be doing. But at the same time it could be the only way they know how. What I said has everything to do with gaslighting. Because, frankly, I know what's like to be looked down on and seen the worst of as that manipulative person myself. I've also seen others go through the process. You're overlooking reasons. Reasons that you could be giving yourself.

Let's boil it down to something simple though. People can mistrust easily. That in and of itself is the root of the problem. That doesn't mean trust should be given easily, but assumptions is the mother of all fuck ups. eg: irrational fear. Projecting from bad past experiences. etc. So on and so forth.

So again, you could be why they do the "harmful manipulation". This isn't just about the gaslighters themselves. It's how WE are treating them. And why. Which is likely going to boil down to your own miss-perception or/and trust issues/irrational fears. Naturally this will vary on a case by case bases.

Your own perception can easily be flawed because you overlooked seeing things any other way. So when someone tries to change your perception they could be seen as a "gaslighter".

Your own reality can easily be a little "bubble" you constructed around yourself when you think you know when you don't know enough. As a result someone that tries to be understood can be seen as a "gaslighter". Due to a "reality" you didn't consider and might not want too.

And if you act like you know it all and try to act superior, that will be challenged. I don't enjoy making people feel like they have to doubt themselves. But if someone acts like that, there may not be any other choice. This can lead to "breaking". Unintended or otherwise. As a result someone that is in this position can be seen as a "gaslighter".

A gaslighter could easily be someone trying not to be walked over as much as the other person. And that other person could be doing that very gaslighting themselves without even realising it. What I'm saying is that there's every possibility someone complaining about gaslighters could BE that gaslighter themselves. And the worst part is they might not even be aware of that.

Much talk of gaslighters, not enough of people that affect them. What if you're that person that installs doubt in others, acts like your own reality is "the truth" and makes people doubt themselves? If someone MEANS to do it, that's at least controlled. But if you're not even AWARE you're doing it then you can see why my alarm bells start ringing. In that situation you're not even aware.