2 AM musings about BDSM lifestyle

2 AM musings about BDSM lifestyle

ivyandtwine​(sub female) • Aug 22, 2018

I'm sure as I interact with more people on the Cage I'll get a reputation for asking questions no one needed to have answered. I'm a bit of study-addict and obsess about things when I find something new. So, hopefully my two latest questions are not offensive to people more familiar with the lifestyle than I am! Please give me better language to communicate if I come across rude.

Question No. 1:
As someone who has been on a path for recovery from PTSD and stablized their Depression, I'm curious about the psychological analyses out there on those who find themselves "into" BDSM. I'm sure people have lots of ignorant opinions, but I have no guilt of my own in reconciling my desires with my past of emotional abuse and self harm. If anything, learning about my submissive/masochistic side helps me heal from that.... Is this normal? A red flag? I'm not involved in any real D/s relationship right now, so I'm safe if it seems unhealthy to those concerned.
I I. I'm curious about those in the scene who have had past toxic codependent relationships, too. I know there's a counter argument these days that codependency doesn't have to be unhealthy, so that's not what I'm curious about. I'm intrigued to know if anyone's compared healthy and unhealthy codependent relationships with healthy and unhealthy D/s dynamics....

Question No. 2
Another light topic... XD
Those of you who come from religious backgrounds or who are currently in a religious community, what has been your experience living with the BDSM lifestyle? Don't get it twisted-- I'm not challenging anyone's beliefs. I have my own journey in this area, and I'm curious to know how others who have/had spiritual inner lives (of any persuasion!) walk with their BDSM desires.... Is there a larger, non-judgemental(!) conversation about this? Were you enriched or liberated by one, the other, or both?
- To break the ice, my parents initially raised me verrrrrryyyy strictly and religiously. Now they look back on spanking their kids with "whackers" (AKA a flexible, textured paddle!! I wish they hadn't thrown it out but instead passed it on to me and feel terrible for what they now see as abuse (disciplining children is not the debate I'm digging for, people). For myself I have no problem looking back on those memories of being punished for not obeying with amusement. In my brain of COURSE I learned early on to redirect the pain (they eventually stopped spanking me because I wouldn't react... Probably their first inkling that I was going to be a handful!!) In fact, now that I am embracing this side of me, I almost wonder if I manufactured that one memory of it feeling good or if I repressed it for years because I was concerned about my sexual purity XD

Anyway.... Hope you all get what I'm trying to say. I'd love to hear your own experiences and thoughts and reading recommendations

Ivy

CrimsonPaw • Aug 22, 2018

Hi, I can only give my opinion from my own experience with #2. I compartmentalize myself. I have my physical self, and my spiritual self. I give them both what they need. It's a delicate balance.

tturtle • Aug 22, 2018

In my experience

One of my subs came from a very physical (unhealthy) relationships. She failed to clue me in on this as it would change my approach to breaking her in as you can say. Anyways one night while playing she had a flashback per say and set the night in a downhill spiral. Everything stopped suddenly but it took her about 6 hours to let me know what happen and about 6 weeks to find out what triggered it. Long story short when you find your Dom make sure during your contract negotiations you let him/her know your past medical or experiences. While your looking for your Dom keep a log book anytime you hear a song that takes you back to that time in your life or anything that takes you there write it down share this log with your Dom. And since you have a past (everyone does) I’d do a 90 day peer 2 peer with your Dom to re-evaluate the issues. As time goes by the symptoms will fade.

CK45​(sub female) • Aug 22, 2018

A 5am response...
Hi Ivy!
I think these are great questions, but then I also have the same propensity to analyze and read about a topic ?.

I am interested to see some of the responses from the people (sub/slave spectrum point of view) who have done the introspective work.

For myself, I have similar past history to you and i spent a lot of time looking at my own "codependency issues" (as the professionals call it) prior to joining the site...
IMHO, there is a labelling issue in the field of psychology that makes us feel shame and makes us question our natural state of being.

Again in my opinion (based on my own reading) I think that the real difference between healthy and unhealthy is when there is an abuse of power and a lack of healthy communication leaving the person in the sub/slave spectrum feeling mentally bad (make sense?) which is totally based on the individual needs of a person (what might make you feel bad won't effect me the same way...that's what I'm getting at...lol ?)
I also feel that the potential for abuse in BDSM relationships is The same if not lower if the person in the sub/slave spectrum has done some personal work. The relationships themselves (at least on the D/s side) seem to encourage communication of needs on both sides and thrive on the understanding and acceptance of those needs.
Just my opinion...but I'm new and could be wrong..sorry if this isn't the "experienced" response you were looking for but wanted to share..

For the second question I can't answer...spiritually I feel much better away from organized religion of any type (I am super great in this place ?)

Looking forward to the responses, thanks for posting this Ivy!

Bianca15​(switch female) • Aug 22, 2018

I have very little to no experience in the lifestyle, however, coming from someone who is primarily submissive, I have to say it isn't only subs that can be codependent. I am actually very independent, and my husband is very codependent. (To the extent that he was going to a concert one evening, would be back later that night, and couldn't understand why I wasn't going to "miss" him.) It is difficult for me to imagine that type of codependency not being unhealthy, but I suppose I could see it in a relationship where both partners have an equal level. For me, because I'm naturally pretty independent and need ample "alone" time, I just feel suffocated.

I really think that compatibility is extremely important in a relationship (perhaps even more important than things like love), and this is one area that I think partners need to be compatible in. Of course, it can be tough to see early on, because of course early in a relationship, a lot of people are going to want to spend more time together then they would normally.

I hope that made any sense at all, I typed it up in a bit of a hurry.

ivyandtwine​(sub female) • Aug 22, 2018

Thanks for everyone's thoughts so far!

Re: Amy
A delicate balance indeed! We are much more paradoxical as human beings than society would have us believe

Re: Jeep
Excellent advise! We love a real life application no, but seriously, I might just try that out for myself regardless of having/not having a partner.

Re: CK & Bianca
Like I said initially, I know there's much more educated discourse out there on codependency or abuse so I don't have any room/desire to comment on that. However, I will say I appreciate your assessment of the importance of communication and compatibility. I completely agree with both of you on those accounts-- and it's one of the many reasons I'm interested in the BDSM community dynamics.

Someone smart (coughFUDcough) recently told me to be cautious in analyzing vanilla and play with separate expectations of outcome.... "Real life" respect and safety still applies in kink, and in any kind of relationship for that matter. Still! Fascinating to discuss!!

Blue kitty​(dom female) • Aug 22, 2018

Well for myself I can pinpoint were my need to b e in control and identify as a domme, it was when I suffered a big loss and everything I always felt just gelled for me.
And since nothing exist in a vacuum most people involve in a BDSM relationship, can point to one or more events, that peaked there intrest, not necessarily a trauma, might be a positve experience. So far my need to be dominant and a top has been postive, not easy but I think I've been able to move past the lost becase of the self awareness I had during that time. Hope that makes sense.

Since I'm *coughbeingmentionedcough*

Fudbar​(dom male){❤️❤️❤️} • Aug 22, 2018

I was tired and sore last night and didn't think I had the brain power for a public reply, so sent my thoughts to Ivy in an email.. in the light of day they aren't so sloppy, and since my comments came up, here's the original plus the bit she mentioned from a reply...


Anyway, #1.. yeah, totally normal to want to work stuff out via kink. Very common. Can be healthy as long as the Dom is emotionally intelligent enough about past abuse/PTSD and how to support there.

Really deep sessions, either mentally or physically can trigger stuff, and being brought back from that in a loving and caring way via aftercare is very healing.

It's also tricky territory. I call it 'going down into the goo'... and there are emotional landmines there that can go off suddenly and violently. It takes s strong bond and time to go there safely, and even then still risks.. but worth it for the healing if both want that.

As for codependent and it's equivalent in D/s, I see a lot of the unhealthy side of that in Master/slave TPE(total power exchange) relationships; Masters who need total control because they can't communicate and lack emotional intelligence, insecurities coming out as anger.. and slaves who ate messed up and give up, don't want to try or contribute to their own healing, and just dunp everything on the Master. Fix me, I give up and won't try. That sort of thing.

As for #2, I've got nothing there, but you'll get tons of good feedback from both well adjusted Christian kinky folks and those who were raised as you were; again, pretty common. Lots here like that who I'm sure will share their insights.

Side note there, common mistake with folks new to kink is to see snd interpret all problems through a BRSM lens. People are people, sometimes problems are just problems, not kink problems. Shit relationships happen all the time in vanilla too.

-Fud

Re: Since I'm *coughbeingmentionedcough*

ivyandtwine​(sub female) • Aug 23, 2018

Thanks friend

Bunnie • Aug 23, 2018

@ Fud, I like the term “going down into the goo.” Very accurate.