Online D/s relationships

curiouskittyy​(sub female){GentlemanX} • Jan 31, 2019

I want to start off by saying that online-only dynamics are not personally for me. However, building a connection with someone long distance with the intent on meeting up with them at some point is an option I am willing to consider. The reason being is that I find I’m just way too much in my head to submit to someone I cannot see/touch and get far to distracted.

Now that’s out of the way... I will say that I fully agree with Savida that online dynamics will vary for everyone. I believe they can be truly beautiful and fulfilling for some and then entirely frustrating and unsatisfying for others (subjective). For example, Bunnie mentions a bad experience and thus has more negative views towards online only relationships. Whereas Savida mentions an amazing experience with her online Dom and so has much more positive views ...showing that it can be fullfiling for some.

Sorry Wakko but I do not believe that you can compare playing Call of Duty and calling yourself a solider to being in an online D/s dynamic ... yes the sub can say they have done certain tasks and then not but so can they in person. Unless their Dom is continuously there watching over them ...there will always be room for deceit. Plus I’ve seen a lot of creative ways that Doms can ensure tasks are carried out online. For example, proof videos/pics etc. Is it the same as real life experiences? Maybe not all aspects of D/s but some can be the same. The communication, trust, carrying out tasks etc are surely the same. Just not any of the physical.

I just personally think that D/s is subjective for everyone and it is always tailored to each dynamic. Just like kinks vary between those in this lifestyle, I think whether or not online-only relationships are for you will also vary. Therefore, maybe if you’re open to the possibility of an online dynamic, you should try it for yourself and see whether it will work out or not. Give it a go.

Just my opinions ☺️

ropefish • Jan 31, 2019

.....okay, the absolute last thing I want to do is derail this thread with an argument, but threads are for discussions and I have opinions and a big mouth, so I'm going for it anyway.

I repeat, I DO NOT want to start any drama, this is just me raising questions I have.

*deep breath* Here we go....

The thing that strikes me, Wakko, when reading your response is that it's a statement about trust. Your supporting arguments are about not being able to hold a sub accountable due to the nature of an online relationship.

I believe there is correlation here, but not causation. You said "Unless this “Dom” has a 24/7 webcam right in the “subs” bedroom that “Dom” will never know." But what about those who do not engage in 24/7 dynamics? If you don't live with your Dom/me, or they don't have cameras in your room, then you could easily lie about doing tasks, break rules, etc, and likely they'd be none the wiser. I feel like that argument is not specific to an online relationship, and could apply to any relationship that is not 24/7.

It also seems like what you are saying is that to have a REAL dynamic, you have to have proof that your sub is complying and being obedient. To me, this seems like a lack of trust. Of course, I wouldn't expect any Dom/me to automatically give trust to an online sub that they will do everything asked of them without lying about it, but I do believe that trust can be built, even in an online setting. I'll admit it's a greater hurdle, for sure, but I don't think it's impossible.

In my last online dynamic, I did everything asked of me to a T, and if I couldn't do it I was honest about it and it was discussed openly and resolved. For me personally, if I'm not submitting to the absolute best of my ability, then it's a waste of my time. And that dedication on my part is what makes it real to me.

I would like to think that in a true dynamic, on or offline, the D type should be able to trust that their submissive is honest, whether they are there, or have video evidence or not. And that honesty and trustworthiness are what *make* the relationship real. If you don't have that honesty, that trust, then no, it's not a real kink relationship. But I think, while difficult, it is possible to have those things even online, and if you truly do have them then the bond that you have is real.

Just my two cents.

This is certainly NOT the Norm in my experience.

K y i v • Jan 31, 2019

ropefish • Jan 31, 2019

Of course the only experiences I have are my own. I did not intend to imply that my online experiences are representative of others.

What would you describe as a normal online dynamic, Kiev?

K y i v • Jan 31, 2019

Nawazakana,
I do not think there is a normal... it is the combination of 2 souls. However in my 24 years online -in lifestyle forums -there is far more deception, ambiguity, role play online than any form of sincerity.

The tendency is to read into the other person ones own emotions, rather than experiencing anything REAL.

MY Motto is and shall always be. " There is NOTHING real until you see the whites of their eyes"

The other motto is that all of the men on Cage are men and so are half the women.....

In my experience...

ropefish • Jan 31, 2019

That response just makes me incredibly sad and disappointed. I'm sad there aren't more honest and sincere subs out there. Subs who take dynamics seriously regardless of the context, subs who can and will *truly* submit to the right person, even if the relationship is long distance.

Trust is built through proof, yes. But I believe as long as you still *need* proof, you haven't truly established trust. I agree with the sentiment that it is harder to build true trust online. I understand negative experiences with deceitful assholes makes it harder to be able to trust anyone moving forward. But I can't agree with the sentiment that trust is *impossible* to build online.

There's at least one person here who believes that without integrity all of this would be a waste of time. I'm ever the optimist, and I hope that being present and vocal in the community, and by sharing my experiences and opinions, that maybe we can move in a direction where there is less deceit. After all, isn't trust one of the founding principles of what we do?

NCarraway​(dom male) • Jan 31, 2019

I believe I have something to add here. I have a fair number of D/s relationships online only, online with occasional meetups and then real life with no online play so i think i can compare and contrast.

Firstly I would say that it will not be the same as a RL relationship. This has to be expected as it is in the way the relationship functions. Secondly, I would approach it, as Sundryxx says, as a relationship but with D/s elements. There are many that go in to these things as 'play' or 'acting out' the D/s - certainly that is how I started - but if that is all you do then you are missing a trick. I have to disagree with MrWakko also. While some of my online relationships have petered out very quickly (weeks or months) two have been very intense rewarding experiences. Communication is key and often several hours communicating (by voice) per day. While touch would have been very rewarding in of itself, those aspects i explored with partners: orgasm control, hypnosis, clothing control, daily reviews, sometimes exercise, food, sometimes tasks, were all fascinating and deeply deeply bonding. You may think that the sexual side would be lacking but with those two partners it was quite mindblowing once the connection was there.

One thing I would say is that I consider online relationships to be inherently unstable. After all it only takes one side to walk away or ghost for a period and all trust is probably gone for good. As such to be successful they require a great deal of open and honest communication - much like other bdsm relationships but i think more so. With physical relationships i think its easier to paper over the cracks by just getting physical - with an online relationship you don't have that option. These types of relationship have allowed me to improve my skills - particularly in identifying issues quickly and dealing with them.

If opting for this type of relationship I would approach it slowly just the same as you should for a real life D/s dynamic. Trust is huge if your communication is all online and the trust needs to be built slowly. I have had relationships like this over many timezones but the most successful for me have been where I am in the same or similar timezone. I like to know that I am in the same part of the day as my girl and that i rise and sleep at the same time. One thing to watch out for are men who want this type of relationship because they already have a physical relationship but want a sub 'on the side'. Thats not healthy and I'd stay away from them if i were you. You will probably never build a decent connection with them and are always at risk of being jettisoned if their primary relationship is at risk. One way to tell I think is to see how much daily time they are willing to make for you. Someone who has you on the side will only contact you infrequently and at strange times - that is less than satisfactory. If something isn't right them then walk away.

I am very much of the mind of Dolly and Nazawakana in that you should give it a try. Nothing ventured nothing gained. Its not right for everyone and you probably shouldnt do it for the rest of your life while excluding physical relationships but i have met plenty of people who have grown as a result of it.

Hope that helps. NC

HuntertheYeenQueen​(dom femme){Allie Kat} • Feb 1, 2019

I feel like it's incredibly unfair to tear apart online relationships of any sort, when plenty on our wonderful site are living examples of how they can work out so well - if both parties are mature, understanding, truthful, and prepared for the new struggles they bring.

Sure, it's easy to lie and cheat and hurt online. But that doesn't make it okay, doesn't mean it's the norm for /all/ relationships like that or people who search for online relationships, and doesn't mean that you're never going to find someone worth having an online thing with.

I don't really know that my relationship works for an example here, as we didn't consider ourselves online, we were long distance, and the goal was always for us to end up actually being together - as we are now. However, we /did/ meet online, and until we got married, never actually spent much time together other than a couple of weeks every several months. And we were vanilla during that time, I had no knowledge really of the lifestyle, other than my love was submissive and it was something I would have to at the very least come to understand and work with for his own happiness, if I didn't end up in the position and mindset I'm in today. But, I still can speak on the levels of trust needed for that to work.

For /any/ relationship, trust is important. But for long-distance? It's even more so, in my opinion. Unless, as people have said, you have cameras up watching everything going on 24/7 (Which... Is creepy af in my opinion and shows an extreme lack of trust on your part), you can /never/ be 100% certain that what your partner is saying is true. /Unless/ you trust them to be telling the truth, and then even if, technically, you still don't /know/, you at the very least believe it to be true. It's up to your partner to prove to you time and time again that their words mean something in a relationship like this.

At any given time, Wolfy could have cheated on me. He could have easily had other people over to his room, and I would have no idea. And the same goes for me - I could've met someone at work or in college and had a fling with them. But we didn't do that. Why? We were committed. As far as we were concerned, even before we ever physically met, we were dating, 100% committed, and that was cheating just as much as it would've been if we lived in the same town and saw each other every day. Because there /is no difference/ if you don't allow there to be one.

He could have easily told me, "I'm going to bed, goodnight" and then gone out to a club, with me not being any wiser. I could have told him, "I can't Skype tonight, going out with dad for dinner" and then went to a bar with my girlfriends and not come home til 2 in the morning (Okay... Well, no I couldn't have cause I was 20 when we started dating, but... Still!). But, we trusted each other not to do stuff like that. And we never did.

If you have open communication and honesty... Long-distance/online can be extremely rewarding. You have /nothing to do/ but talk and get to know each other... I truly believe our relationship moved way faster than it could've in person, because of the distance. He knew things about me within months, that I still haven't even told some of my best friends after knowing each other for years. Because all we did was talk. Build up trust and open communication. Get to know each other.

Even with BOTH of us having physical touch as our love language, we made the long-distance work. It sucked, so much, when we had to be apart. But when love is concerned, the physical aspect of things isn't the most important part.

/Staying/ online was never an option for us. I do feel like, at some point, it's logical for things to move to physical after a while if you're trying to do it long-term. But that DOES NOT mean it /has to/ for everyone! Just because something doesn't work for me, doesn't mean it won't work for someone else. So, if people decide they never want their relationship to move past online, and they make it work that way? Then more power to them.

As long as there's no victims, no one is being harmed in the process (Which is why I will NEVER be okay with or advocate cheating in any form), then we really have no place to judge.

Online isn't for everyone. Long-distance isn't for anyone. But, I don't feel it's right for anyone to judge or immediately say it's /impossible/ just because it's not the easiest or for some people it won't work. Warn of the difficulties you can face, but don't chase people off of potentially finding the "one" because they're now afraid of judgement or it never working out because of what others told them.

I used to think long-distance and online could never work. I turned down my love the first time he asked me out because of it. If I never changed my mind... I would never have experienced the amount of true, selfless, pure love I experience every day now. I would've missed out on the greatest relationship I could ever have. I truly believe no one can ever compare to him.

It may work, it may not. It's up to the individual in the end.

Bunnie • Feb 1, 2019

To clarify, because it appears I need to... I’m actually not against online relationships. My negative experience wasn’t because it was an online relationship. It was a relationship that ended. I was simply pointing out the struggles I personally faced and experienced, and the beliefs I have acquired from those experiences, through observation and through talking with others.

In fact this topic always makes me laugh. The same people arguing over who’s right. Yes, we all have our preferences... yes, everyone is free to do whatever they want... yes, there are pros and cons for everything. However, does that mean we’re not allowed to discuss it?

It seems that you’re only allowed to voice an opinion as long as it’s all inclusive. Well some people find that online doesn’t work for them... and they’re allowed to voice that. It doesn’t make them closed minded or mean or intolerant.

In fact, it seemed that most people were actually just sharing their thoughts and experiences... it didn’t seem to me, up to and including my post, that anyone was putting down the concept of online. But I guess everyone interprets things how they want to. I’m just a little tired of my words being twisted.

curiouskittyy​(sub female){GentlemanX} • Feb 1, 2019

@ bunnie

I don’t know if you are referring to me or not. But in case you are.. I never said you were against online relationships. I simply said your views on them appeared to be more negative (in my opinion) due to your own experiences. Whereas Savida’s experience seems to have been far more pleasant and thus her opinions much more positive on the subject.

The point I was simply trying to make was that online relationships can be fullfilling for some and unsatisfying for others. That they will vary for each person and that if you’re open to the possibility of an online only relationship than you should just ‘go for it’.

I think it’s a little unfair to say that the same people always argue over who’s right and that opinions can only be voiced if they are inclusive. I think most here have had a difference of opinion regarding online relationships. But there is a way of putting your point across that is respectful and polite. No one has to force their opinion on others. I also think it’s a little contradictory that you are saying “aren’t we allowed to discuss it?” And then jumping on the defence wagon when someone just used what you said as an example to make a valid point.

Anyway, I have said what I think on the matter. I have nothing further to add regarding online relationships. These are simply my own views on the topic, regardless whether they are/are not inclusive.