Feminism: Has it gone too far?

Knightsundere​(sub male) • May 16, 2023

I, for one, would not mind more dominant women. Hopefully the upwards trend continues.

That and, kinda dumb in my opinion that masculinity and femininity are inherently associated with the male and female genders. The root expressions of both are mindsets, worldviews, and perceptions - all things that are learned in a different way from person to person. Not educated enough to talk about genetics playing a part but I view masculinity (disregarding my disdain for the association with men) as willpower, selflessness, aggression, stoicism, and persistence. My personal admiration for those qualities is as a result of engaging with media and male figures in my life, so I don't see strong evidence against the inability of a female version of myself brought up in an equivalent life not holding the same understanding since the basis of it is environmental influence.

OutAndAbout​(dom male) • May 16, 2023

I want to say this, I love women and a feminine, submissive, sexy woman is a true piece of God's art. Men and women, together, built this world and we need to get back to that cooperative effort and stop fighting across genders. For every masculine woman, there is a feminine male, and that's OK, it's been that way throughout history.

First, my primary issue with feminism is that it cherry picks what should be equal. Now they only want equality in the board rooms, not to be drafted, and not to have equality in sanitation, brick laying, or road work. If you're going to establish that equality, how much freedom must be sacrificed to force people into filling those roles?
Second, that it's purpose now is not to elevate women, the laws and society have largely remedied equality, but it is now denigrating masculine men and eroding the family unit.

Feminism now has morphed into whatever it needs to be to maintain power and income.

If you were truly about expressing our natural selves, why is masculinity inherently toxic? There will be toxic people of both genders, but why focus on men? I think that accepting men as we are is a prerequisite for everything else. And, if you're so happy out in the working world as a dominant boss, why would you come home and be submissive? I am dominant in all areas of my life and I'm content. It would seem that you are not as much so, seeking to fill a natural desire.

Historically, women have NOT been weak, that is not the same as submissive. Families, the building of our country, western expansion, have all been done by men AND women who could run a family and work hard. The wife would work at home to store and prepare food, teach, raise children, and suffer much loss. I would not go toe to toe with any of my grandmothers, but they respected their husbands and supported them, and shared common goals.

In my opinion, women now are lazy and spoiled and only whine and complain anymore instead of getting to work. Many women are selfish, entitled bitches thinking that men should do everything while they sit home and browse social media or watch television. This isn't a partnership, it's enslavement of the man to satisfy their lifestyle desires.
Women are being emotionally manipulated in almost every aspect of life, from marketing, politics, and news, especially around death, where the fear of someone dying allows them to suspend all reason for a cause. People in power and influence are increasingly using fear and that is not good. And instead of doing their due diligence and a little research, they huddle up and attack anything they are told to.

Now, this is an opinion, I didn't attack anyone and if you use pejoratives to make your point, then my last paragraph stands. I want to have dialog, I appreciate it and suggest that we can grow from expressing thoughts. But this comes from a lifetime of observation and experience across many areas. The beauty of trying to have a free society is that we allow for these variances, but there has to be some common ground founded in truth, such as sex and gender mean the same thing and there are only 2.

PandorasRose • May 16, 2023

I never said anything about big emotions being a bad thing, I simply pointed out it's something typically misunderstood. It was my point of why alot of women could be drawn to more dominant positions and why men could be drawn to submissive positions psychologically. Men take charge in other aspects of their life but might want to give up that control in the home, which is common in other cultures and throughout history. The home was the wife's domain to control. I will give you that modern feminism has been divisive and turned very much into women's superiority movement, which is why I don't call myself a feminist or if I do I use "second wave feminist" to seperate from the modern/third wave. I don't believe that feminism is WHY so many women are taking on dominant roles in relationships though, I think women typically are more drawn to dominant roles in relationships naturally and even take on dominant roles often, but aren't really educated on what that means due to the spread of certain religions claiming subservience is where women should be towards their husbands. The dominant roles were more behind closed doors but still very much there. The doors are just opening up because women are talking about it and exploring this more openly now.

VictorKingston{I&A} • May 16, 2023

No.

This is a **stupid** question designed to start a **stupid** discussion born of one or several of the following;

1. Rejection.
2. Fear of personal failure
3. Fear of not living up to some random fucking standard you've had hoisted upon you
4. A completely misunderstanding of the capacity of rational humans when given the freedom to be who they want to consent freely to their own wants, needs, and desires.
5. A failure to understand why feminism exists and a lack of accurate knowledge of the structural methods by which women have been oppressed and continue to be via the systems that exist and govern us. (Here's a fun thought experiment for you to figure out if you can identify these structures. Were women ever "granted" the right to vote or did the systems in place simply stop denying them a fundamental tenant of Democracy? And as a follow up, how do we discuss that fact in everyday conversation, every piece of media, and every celebration of women's suffrage **ever**? There are right answers here.)
6. A deep internalized self hatred coming from some bit of trauma in your earlier life that you have yet to deal with.
7. You're just fucking trolling.

I'm going to say it is some combination of the first six and is absolutely partially number seven. Because the wild generalizations you and, *shockingly*, a number of respondents are willing to engage in are breathtaking.

Also, just to be clear, how fucking dare you even remotely imply that any man who thinks that women maybe shouldn't be treated like second class citizens is somehow less masculine than whatever weird power fantasy you have decided masculinity should be. And you "don't look forward to talking about this", because the moment people started pointing out, admittedly much less bluntly than I am, how utterly absurd these thoughts are you fucking played the "Lol look at the person having been confronted with an incredibly stupid idea expressing how stupid the idea is. They're just getting upset for no reason and being toxic". Which is a game that fucking children play. People who present stupid ideas in the public square get to be told their ideas are dumb. To just go "Well I'm not going to argue with you since you're just too toxic" is some fucking logical fallacy bullshit.

The idea at the heart of feminism is that women should be given the same choices, chances, and opportunities that have been to men over the thousands of years of our history. Some of those choices include who to fuck, how to fuck them, when you would like to stop fucking them, and the ability to express your wants, needs, and desires and have them respected by your partner through mutual consent. If you are for some reason unable to engage with your personal vision of masculinity because everyone says they don't want to fucking hang out with you, that's your problem not theirs.

To anyone, who is arguing in the affirmative for this question, I'm begging you to go to therapy. Begging. I would also likely to strongly encourage you to not engage in any form of BDSM until you have the clearest possible understanding of the power dynamics that exist and are maintained outside of BDSM before you try to engage in any exchange of power **within** BDSM.

EDIT: Jesus Christ reading through the responses from men on here. Fucking hell my dudes. There being structural realities that make your life shit are in no way shape or form linked to feminism. Your problems are being caused by the same things women are having to deal with. A society with rules and systems designed to make your life worse because you'll do exactly what you're doing. There is a stupid thing you have to put up with, feminism is like "I don't wanna put up with that", and your response is to blame feminism for not wanting true equality? Why the fuck do you want an equality where everyone is the same amount of miserable? Why isn't your response to one group of people going "that thing you're dealing with is some horseshit and I want no part of it" to go "Well they don't want real equality"? Why isn't the response "hey that is some fucking bullshit I'm having to put up with. You're right, we should fucking be angry about that because it's shit for me too and it makes sense that you wouldn't want to do that shitty thing as well".

Absolutely. Fucking. Wild.

simplylaura​(sub female){djinni} • May 16, 2023

"In my opinion, women now are lazy and spoiled and only whine and complain anymore instead of getting to work. Many women are selfish, entitled bitches thinking that men should do everything while they sit home and browse social media or watch television. This isn't a partnership, it's enslavement of the man to satisfy their lifestyle desires."

You try to play the morally superior card in your last paragraph by saying that you aren't using pejoratives but this paragraph is the definition of pejorative. Literal contempt and disapproval. How are things going for ya on the incel and MGTOW boards?

Dom Pinnacle​(dom male) • May 16, 2023

You were fair until the last two lines. How the F do you not see the toxicity in what you wrote? Men aren't allowed to call women out. AT ALL. And so my question has been answered. Feminism HAS gone too far. It's not only men that feel this way. Grown adult children are majority of the responses. You couldn't just say why feminism is good or bad. Where it can be improved. No. People ran their dirty little mouths and proved me right. AGAIN.

simplylaura​(sub female){djinni} • May 16, 2023

Damn. I was awaiting your approval with bated breath. Not gonna stop running my "dirty little mouth" against misogynist Dom wannabe trolls anytime soon.

Logannnin​(sub female) • May 17, 2023

Feminism is about a simple question: do you think people should be equal in society regardless of sex? If no, simply leave and live in the woods with the rest of your backwards, idiotic brethren where you will never get over your inflated ego. If yes, you're a feminist.